WEBVTT 00:00:00.001 --> 00:00:05.420 Hello and welcome to Python Bytes, where we deliver Python news and headlines directly to your earbuds. 00:00:05.420 --> 00:00:10.980 This is episode 172, recorded March 4th, 2020. 00:00:10.980 --> 00:00:12.500 And I am Brian Okken. 00:00:12.500 --> 00:00:13.360 And I'm Michael Kennedy. 00:00:13.360 --> 00:00:16.240 And this episode is brought to you by DigitalOcean. 00:00:16.240 --> 00:00:20.080 And they've got all sorts of cool stuff we'll hear about later. 00:00:20.080 --> 00:00:21.900 Who's going first? I always forget. 00:00:21.900 --> 00:00:25.860 You know, I guess I'm going to jump in on this one because I've got some cool stuff from Hank. 00:00:25.860 --> 00:00:29.240 Hank! He even messed his name up worse than I do. 00:00:29.240 --> 00:00:29.960 Hennyk? 00:00:30.260 --> 00:00:31.160 Okay, cool. 00:00:31.160 --> 00:00:32.440 All right. Sorry, Hennyk. 00:00:32.440 --> 00:00:34.900 I have to give you a bad time because he gives me a bad time all the time. 00:00:34.900 --> 00:00:40.580 Yeah, well, it's a cool but unusual name, which is probably going to result in some mispronunciation. 00:00:40.580 --> 00:00:47.120 He's got a cool article he tweeted about a little while ago, a week or two ago. 00:00:47.120 --> 00:00:48.620 And I just thought it was really interesting. 00:00:48.620 --> 00:00:53.880 And basically, it's his thoughts on running Python in production. 00:00:54.560 --> 00:00:59.360 So it's kind of a look back on some places. 00:00:59.360 --> 00:01:12.500 He heard interesting discussions on people running Python in production, as well as maybe some got some nice little call outs on things that seem solved, but aren't solved that are interesting to talk about and whatnot. 00:01:12.500 --> 00:01:14.540 So I just thought I'd maybe talk about that a little bit. 00:01:14.540 --> 00:01:14.840 Yeah. 00:01:15.040 --> 00:01:15.180 Yeah. 00:01:15.180 --> 00:01:19.180 I mean, I definitely relate to this being someone who runs Python in production. 00:01:19.180 --> 00:01:28.420 So in order to keep the two podcasts, the courses and various other things, other services running, there's like eight servers and whatnot. 00:01:28.420 --> 00:01:33.920 So there's a non-trivial amount of DevOps production architecture stuff. 00:01:34.020 --> 00:01:40.800 It's not anywhere near Facebook, Google or whatever, but it's way more than, you know, a $5 host running some like WordPress thing. 00:01:40.800 --> 00:01:40.960 Right. 00:01:40.960 --> 00:01:42.860 So it's meaningful, I guess. 00:01:42.860 --> 00:01:54.920 So anyway, his article, basically the premise is that he's missing a key part of the public Python discourse in that it seems like people really aren't talking about running Python in production. 00:01:55.200 --> 00:01:58.860 Although maybe the exception of Instagram or Spotify, right? 00:01:58.860 --> 00:01:59.120 Yeah. 00:01:59.120 --> 00:01:59.980 That's pretty interesting. 00:01:59.980 --> 00:02:01.760 And he listened to this podcast episode. 00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:06.840 He recommended, or I guess listen to this podcast episode, sort of kicked him off down this path of thinking about it. 00:02:06.840 --> 00:02:10.400 Like there was this podcast and I'm trying to remember what was it called? 00:02:10.400 --> 00:02:11.100 Here, I'll pull it up. 00:02:11.100 --> 00:02:13.560 It's called, well, running in production. 00:02:13.560 --> 00:02:18.840 Actually, it's a pretty interesting one by Nick Gentakis. 00:02:18.840 --> 00:02:21.200 Probably mispronounced that name as well. 00:02:21.200 --> 00:02:29.940 But Nick's got an interesting thing where he talks to people from all sorts of different technology backgrounds, JavaScript or Ruby or Python or whatever. 00:02:29.940 --> 00:02:48.180 And he interviewed this guy named Gareth Thomas from the UK where they have some Plone, I believe it's Plone app, that is actually running like 10% of, getting like traffic from 10% of the UK schools or something really interesting in this. 00:02:48.800 --> 00:02:58.920 But it was more interesting to just think about listening to that episode, looking at Hank's article and saying, when do I agree with them? 00:02:58.920 --> 00:02:59.980 When do I disagree? 00:02:59.980 --> 00:03:03.480 And he said, look, I disagree with a lot of their choices, actually. 00:03:03.480 --> 00:03:06.000 I think they're using microservices a bunch. 00:03:06.000 --> 00:03:10.460 And he was like, thank goodness, I'm not doing microservices, basically. 00:03:11.160 --> 00:03:15.560 And it's really interesting, even if you disagree, to think about the trade-offs that people made. 00:03:15.560 --> 00:03:27.160 Because while you might make different trade-offs, that might be because you have different goals or different things you're optimizing or different experiences or things that you need over what they need. 00:03:27.160 --> 00:03:27.680 Right? 00:03:27.680 --> 00:03:32.980 So I just think this idea of exploring how people are running Python in production, how they're solving problems, it's pretty interesting. 00:03:32.980 --> 00:03:45.100 Yeah, I also kind of have to agree that I like the idea of hearing more about the pathway of why people are where they're at, what decisions they made and what things they faced and why they made those choices. 00:03:45.100 --> 00:03:53.220 Because that's almost more interesting than what end product they came up with is what the path they took to it. 00:03:53.220 --> 00:03:57.220 I mean, like Lord of the Rings would be nothing without the path to the end, right? 00:03:57.620 --> 00:03:58.100 Exactly. 00:03:58.100 --> 00:03:59.800 Oh, yeah, and they get the ring back. 00:03:59.800 --> 00:04:01.020 Yeah. 00:04:01.020 --> 00:04:06.320 Yeah, so his article, like all good complaints, comes with a suggestion. 00:04:06.320 --> 00:04:11.020 And he says, at the end, here's a bunch of things that could get discussed more. 00:04:11.020 --> 00:04:12.460 And so here's an offer. 00:04:12.460 --> 00:04:24.460 I would love to encourage people doing interesting stuff with Python, running websites or APIs and whatnot, to tell them basically to do talks at PyCon, at meetups, and in blogs. 00:04:24.820 --> 00:04:30.820 And I think he even offered to help mentor people to get those kind of talks accepted more frequently at conferences. 00:04:30.820 --> 00:04:31.920 I think that's a great idea. 00:04:31.920 --> 00:04:32.740 I think it's a great idea. 00:04:32.740 --> 00:04:37.460 And, you know, maybe we should do that at the PDX Python West meetup. 00:04:37.460 --> 00:04:38.680 That'd be fun. 00:04:38.680 --> 00:04:38.980 Yeah. 00:04:38.980 --> 00:04:39.320 Yeah. 00:04:39.320 --> 00:04:40.480 We think about that. 00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:46.580 But yeah, I definitely like this idea because on one hand, if it's kind of always the same story, it's not that interesting. 00:04:46.580 --> 00:04:49.260 But I do think there's a lot of trade-offs that people are making. 00:04:49.260 --> 00:04:52.520 And I think it's pretty fun to see what's working. 00:04:52.520 --> 00:04:54.240 And it's clearly going on. 00:04:54.240 --> 00:05:04.620 We're just not talking about it because we're, I mean, you and I have noticed that there's a lot of people in the Python community that are in the website or the website of the Python community. 00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:09.880 And it's way more than just the Instagrams and Dropboxes of the world. 00:05:09.880 --> 00:05:11.040 Yeah, absolutely. 00:05:11.040 --> 00:05:11.700 Absolutely. 00:05:11.700 --> 00:05:13.180 Yeah, it's really cool. 00:05:13.180 --> 00:05:15.520 And there's a bunch of more stuff that I'm not covering in this article. 00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:21.900 But I mostly covered it because I love his offer of like, hey, let's get more of this conversation out there. 00:05:21.900 --> 00:05:23.360 You know, we could do open spaces. 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:29.580 We could do Python, PyCon talks, suggestions, you know, proposals, things like that. 00:05:29.580 --> 00:05:44.620 I guess one final thing to throw out there is Dan Bader and I did have this conversation for Talk Python and the training and Python Bytes and whatnot, as well as for RealPython over on Talk Python episode 215 at the last PyCon. 00:05:44.860 --> 00:05:46.160 We recorded that one. 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:49.060 So we'll see what happens with this PyCon. 00:05:49.060 --> 00:05:51.880 But that's a small contribution towards that. 00:05:51.880 --> 00:05:53.840 And that was a really popular episode. 00:05:53.840 --> 00:06:02.840 But I definitely want to encourage people to take Hennick up on this, up on his offer here and get the word out a little bit more. 00:06:02.840 --> 00:06:03.420 All right. 00:06:03.420 --> 00:06:04.260 Yeah. 00:06:04.260 --> 00:06:04.440 Yeah. 00:06:04.440 --> 00:06:11.100 So, Brian, when I think about testing and whatnot, I feel like you should really be honest and like testing to tell a true story. 00:06:11.100 --> 00:06:13.940 And you should never like cheat with testing, should you? 00:06:14.020 --> 00:06:16.120 Yeah, only, yes, you should definitely cheat. 00:06:16.120 --> 00:06:17.400 Cheat as much as you can. 00:06:17.400 --> 00:06:19.100 Tell us about this next one. 00:06:19.100 --> 00:06:22.020 So this comes from, I think it's Simon Willison. 00:06:22.020 --> 00:06:26.700 The article is called How to Cheat at Unit Tests with pytest and Black. 00:06:26.700 --> 00:06:35.080 It's got all my favorite things, testing, pytest, Black, and well, I'm not a fan of the unit part, but we'll get there. 00:06:35.080 --> 00:06:43.180 So the premise is, I'm going to quote this, in pure test-driven development, you write a test first and you don't start on the implementation 00:06:43.180 --> 00:06:45.780 until you've watched a test fail. 00:06:45.780 --> 00:06:46.720 Okay. 00:06:46.720 --> 00:06:50.340 So the idea is you, it's the red-green refactor thing. 00:06:50.340 --> 00:06:55.380 So you write a failing test, you write code to make it pass, and then you refactor it so you're happy with it. 00:06:55.380 --> 00:06:56.600 And if I don't do that, I'm cheating? 00:06:56.600 --> 00:06:57.300 Yeah, apparently. 00:06:57.480 --> 00:06:59.800 I think I might have cheated accidentally, recently. 00:06:59.800 --> 00:07:00.280 Okay. 00:07:00.280 --> 00:07:01.520 Well, yeah. 00:07:01.520 --> 00:07:07.280 My thoughts partly on that is there is no such thing as pure test-driven development. 00:07:07.280 --> 00:07:10.560 Even Kent Beck himself says he didn't make this stuff up. 00:07:10.560 --> 00:07:14.040 He rediscovered it from previous best practices. 00:07:14.580 --> 00:07:17.060 So there's no pure in test-driven development. 00:07:17.060 --> 00:07:21.220 We can't even agree on, like, whether a mox are good or evil or what a unit is. 00:07:21.220 --> 00:07:23.060 So whatever works for you, man. 00:07:23.060 --> 00:07:26.680 So Simon's process really was to cheat on this. 00:07:26.680 --> 00:07:30.320 And the way, and I think this is just clever pragmatism. 00:07:30.820 --> 00:07:39.620 His cheat method was to write a pytest test that calls a function that he's, so he's been working on a function, and he thinks he's happy with it. 00:07:39.620 --> 00:07:46.740 And he writes a test that calls it, but then compares the output to, you know, something he knows won't pass. 00:07:46.740 --> 00:07:49.800 Like, just the output equals false or something. 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:51.640 And you know that a cert's going to fail. 00:07:51.640 --> 00:07:55.600 So you run the test, and when it fails, you take a look at the output. 00:07:55.720 --> 00:08:02.920 And if you're happy with the output, you just copy that, just highlight it, copy and paste it into your test, and now your test should pass. 00:08:02.920 --> 00:08:11.340 So this feels like cheating, but it's really just taking a manual test and turning it into an automated regression test. 00:08:11.340 --> 00:08:16.980 Especially when you're exploring stuff, I think this is a great way to build up some of your test coverage. 00:08:17.180 --> 00:08:27.400 The bit about black is that the output might be this big, long blob something, like a dictionary or a big list or something, and it might not be formatted well. 00:08:27.400 --> 00:08:33.380 And that's where he just turns black on his test code and reformat it nicely and makes sure it still passes. 00:08:33.380 --> 00:08:35.600 So I think this is a good time saver. 00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:36.260 This is interesting. 00:08:36.260 --> 00:08:45.860 I was working on some tests recently where I had a big chunk of test data that I wanted to compare against something, kind of like he's describing here. 00:08:46.740 --> 00:08:47.920 And I was really torn. 00:08:47.920 --> 00:08:49.500 I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. 00:08:49.500 --> 00:08:54.500 You know, I put this at the top of my test file so I could reference it, right? 00:08:54.500 --> 00:08:55.620 I didn't put it in the test. 00:08:55.620 --> 00:08:59.440 I put it kind of separate because I'm like, well, this thing is, you know, it basically fills the screen. 00:08:59.440 --> 00:09:01.900 So I didn't want it to generate a huge test. 00:09:01.900 --> 00:09:03.860 I want to say compare against that thing, right? 00:09:04.520 --> 00:09:13.920 And one of the thoughts I had was creating like a, I don't know, a test data module where I could pull those things out, like put it completely into a different file and pull it back. 00:09:13.920 --> 00:09:18.060 And it sounds like that might also be a nice way to organize things here. 00:09:18.060 --> 00:09:26.760 But at the same time, it takes what you would see as I'm comparing against this and it hides it away behind, you know, a label of whatever that test module is. 00:09:26.760 --> 00:09:27.960 What are your thoughts on that? 00:09:27.960 --> 00:09:29.300 Good, bad, indifferent? 00:09:29.480 --> 00:09:39.260 I think there's lots of times where that is a good thing, especially like you said, it's a data, a big structure or something that you're comparing against. 00:09:39.260 --> 00:09:51.020 One common method to do something like that is if there's like, for instance, it isn't really what you're asking, but if there's, instead of comparing a whole bunch of different fields or something, to actually compare structures. 00:09:51.020 --> 00:09:56.880 So to create the expected data structure, especially with data classes, it makes it pretty easy. 00:09:56.880 --> 00:09:59.640 You can just say, this is my expected object. 00:09:59.640 --> 00:10:03.260 And what I got back was this thing and compare those two. 00:10:03.260 --> 00:10:12.560 Now, if that thing, if all the data is huge and it makes it more clean to work with your test, to stick it in a different file, then go for it. 00:10:12.560 --> 00:10:13.380 I think that's fine. 00:10:13.840 --> 00:10:23.420 I mean, there's a method of regression testing, which is kind of the model of, I know it works now and I'm going to modify the code for some reason. 00:10:23.420 --> 00:10:31.500 So I, instead of trying to come up with thorough tests for everything, just running it with a bunch of logging and stuff and capturing all that. 00:10:31.500 --> 00:10:32.320 Yeah, absolutely. 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:38.280 And then running it again and make sure all of your output and logging is the same and just comparing against that. 00:10:38.560 --> 00:10:44.160 It's yucky to work with in the long run, but in the short term, it's a pretty handy, quick thing to do. 00:10:44.160 --> 00:10:44.420 Yeah. 00:10:44.420 --> 00:10:49.100 Instead of changing your entire architecture so you can mock out everything and then who knows if you get that right. 00:10:49.100 --> 00:10:51.760 You're just like, all right, I don't want it to change. 00:10:51.760 --> 00:10:54.100 Let's just start from like, keep it where it is. 00:10:54.100 --> 00:10:58.440 And if it breaks, then we'll figure out if that's a change we wanted. 00:10:58.440 --> 00:10:58.740 Right. 00:10:58.740 --> 00:11:00.820 But just to know that it didn't change is really helpful. 00:11:00.820 --> 00:11:01.800 And that's a quickies way. 00:11:01.800 --> 00:11:02.200 I like it. 00:11:02.200 --> 00:11:02.420 Right. 00:11:02.420 --> 00:11:06.800 And I mean, change detector tests are a smell that you need to be aware of because they're not. 00:11:07.240 --> 00:11:09.420 You want to be able to change your architecture. 00:11:09.420 --> 00:11:14.260 As long as you can make sure that you're checking for, you don't want the behavior to change. 00:11:14.260 --> 00:11:16.360 Sometimes those are good things. 00:11:16.360 --> 00:11:16.760 Yep. 00:11:16.760 --> 00:11:17.160 I agree. 00:11:17.160 --> 00:11:18.000 Be a pragmatist. 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:18.300 For sure. 00:11:18.300 --> 00:11:18.780 Good advice. 00:11:18.780 --> 00:11:20.220 You know what else is good advice? 00:11:20.220 --> 00:11:21.300 Work with DigitalOcean. 00:11:21.300 --> 00:11:22.300 Yeah, definitely. 00:11:22.300 --> 00:11:27.420 We've been working with DigitalOcean and we've got a lot of our infrastructure there and we've been really happy with it. 00:11:27.980 --> 00:11:32.780 And so one of the things they've got, they've got Kubernetes clusters and all sorts of stuff. 00:11:32.780 --> 00:11:40.560 So, however, getting started with hosting and running Linux servers or Kubernetes clusters and all that stuff can be a little tricky. 00:11:40.560 --> 00:11:47.540 And getting into that, going from just building on your own computer to dealing with all of this, some people might not know how to do that. 00:11:47.720 --> 00:11:51.720 And so that's one of the reasons why DigitalOcean launched their new support center. 00:11:52.260 --> 00:11:58.380 So the support center makes it easier to find the answers to your questions and to get help that you need right when you need it. 00:11:58.380 --> 00:12:05.140 You can search across product docs or community tutorials and forums and it's all in one place and you can get all your answers. 00:12:05.140 --> 00:12:08.340 So I'm sure that's going to help a lot of people really a lot. 00:12:08.340 --> 00:12:09.900 So check this out. 00:12:09.900 --> 00:12:15.240 You can visit pythonbytes.fm/do support to see their tutorials. 00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:22.700 And of course, you can use pythonbytes.fm/digitalocean to get $100 credit for new users. 00:12:22.700 --> 00:12:24.780 Their tutorials are pretty awesome. 00:12:24.780 --> 00:12:29.400 And I just want to tell people like how helpful they have been. 00:12:29.400 --> 00:12:36.060 So typically, you know, especially when I was getting started, I'm like, man, how come this micro whiskey thing won't start? 00:12:36.060 --> 00:12:38.340 It seems like it should work when I run it, but it won't. 00:12:38.340 --> 00:12:43.320 It's probably something like the logging file didn't have permission to write through or something weird like that. 00:12:44.160 --> 00:12:47.900 You go search for that and it's very likely that one of these tutorials is going to come up. 00:12:47.900 --> 00:12:51.480 But, you know, I just went and put micro whiskey into their tutorial thing here. 00:12:51.480 --> 00:12:56.700 And it comes up how to serve a flask app with micro whiskey and Nginx on Ubuntu 18.04. 00:12:56.700 --> 00:12:57.940 But then it has a dropdown. 00:12:57.940 --> 00:13:04.100 Oh, would you like to do that on 16.04 or 14.04 or maybe on CentOS 7 or whatever? 00:13:04.100 --> 00:13:09.060 And you can actually change the operating system it's running on and the tutorial will adapt. 00:13:09.060 --> 00:13:11.980 I mean, it's ridiculous like how involved it is. 00:13:11.980 --> 00:13:14.100 Yeah, they've really done a lot to help. 00:13:14.100 --> 00:13:18.040 Novice users come up to speed to get things running well. 00:13:18.040 --> 00:13:20.000 Yeah, I just remember how helpful that stuff was for me. 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:22.860 So, yeah, check them out at pythonbytes.fm/digitalization. 00:13:22.860 --> 00:13:26.000 Get that credit, but then use their support center to actually get going. 00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:27.820 You know what I'm glad I don't have to support? 00:13:27.820 --> 00:13:29.960 Hundreds of microservices. 00:13:29.960 --> 00:13:31.640 Yeah, me too. 00:13:32.780 --> 00:13:42.480 So, I think I found this from Mahenyuk's article when he was talking about how people were running in production and whether or not they should have microservices or not. 00:13:42.480 --> 00:13:45.920 And that podcast I told you about, I believe those people were using microservices. 00:13:46.300 --> 00:13:47.800 He's like, yeah, no way. 00:13:47.800 --> 00:13:48.520 No, thank you. 00:13:48.520 --> 00:13:55.500 And referred to this article by Alexandra Noonan, who works for a company called Segment. 00:13:56.320 --> 00:13:59.500 And this is like a retrospective on their experience. 00:13:59.500 --> 00:14:01.680 So, they had started out with a monolith app. 00:14:01.680 --> 00:14:03.640 I believe they're doing JavaScript, but it doesn't really matter. 00:14:03.640 --> 00:14:08.960 Basically, it's like package managers and maintaining versions that talk to APIs. 00:14:08.960 --> 00:14:10.420 The same story for Python. 00:14:10.420 --> 00:14:14.520 You know, you just switch the code samples or whatever, and they're not really relevant. 00:14:14.760 --> 00:14:21.240 So, there's this article called Goodbye Microservices from 100 Problem Children to One Superstar. 00:14:21.240 --> 00:14:30.340 And it talks about how Segment was founded during the height of microservices as the architecture du jour, right? 00:14:30.340 --> 00:14:31.340 Architecture of the day. 00:14:31.340 --> 00:14:36.060 And how to sort of decided that was going to solve all their problems. 00:14:36.060 --> 00:14:37.700 And at first, it did. 00:14:37.700 --> 00:14:42.260 But as they grew and grew and grew, it turned out to be such a huge headache. 00:14:42.840 --> 00:14:44.940 So, they had three software developers. 00:14:44.940 --> 00:14:58.660 And eventually, they said, basically, their three software developers were spending almost all their time tracking down broken tests across these hundreds of different variations of microservices and all sorts of stuff. 00:14:58.660 --> 00:15:00.340 And they were just going nowhere. 00:15:00.340 --> 00:15:12.820 So, it talks about how all the benefits that microservices should have, like prove modularity, reduce testing burden, better functional composition, isolation, team autonomy, and all that. 00:15:12.820 --> 00:15:20.700 And how many of those things turned around to actually become like molasses in their world and slowed them down instead of letting them work faster. 00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:28.360 So, basically, it's a really concrete story about how they took a step back from microservices, how they actually made that step backwards. 00:15:28.360 --> 00:15:32.840 Because with 100 microservices into one app, that's kind of a beast to pull off. 00:15:33.520 --> 00:15:37.000 And how it helped them basically get everything under control again. 00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:41.560 So, what's really interesting is basically the places where things broke down. 00:15:41.560 --> 00:15:49.360 So, for example, each microservice was talking to a similar but slightly different API, like customer integrations and stuff. 00:15:50.100 --> 00:15:53.120 And they had slight different needs. 00:15:53.120 --> 00:16:01.380 So, over time, some of the core bits of those libraries were slightly different across the different APIs. 00:16:01.380 --> 00:16:09.980 And it became, instead of having things you manage separately for each endpoint, you actually ended up with 100 different services, all of which you had to manage. 00:16:10.180 --> 00:16:13.320 And, like, if you're going to make a big change, you've got to test it against all these variations. 00:16:13.320 --> 00:16:15.880 Their tests were super slow to run. 00:16:15.880 --> 00:16:17.920 And there's just a lot of things. 00:16:17.920 --> 00:16:22.660 Like, also dependencies, you know, as in requirements.txt type dependencies. 00:16:22.660 --> 00:16:23.160 Yeah. 00:16:23.160 --> 00:16:29.160 They wouldn't upgrade all of them at the same time because they wanted to make sure that they had to test it and whatnot. 00:16:29.160 --> 00:16:40.080 And so, if you're going to, you know, be running on, say, requests 2.1 over here and 2.2 over there, are you sure, you know, like, if there's a problem with that? 00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:41.680 Like, how do you deal with that? 00:16:41.680 --> 00:16:49.220 Now, I'm a big fan of the big monolith type apps and keeping a little more control over it that way. 00:16:49.220 --> 00:16:51.100 So, I'm all behind this sentiment. 00:16:51.100 --> 00:16:57.240 But I do feel like they could have actually done a lot of work on the DevOps side to make this dramatically better. 00:16:57.240 --> 00:16:59.880 And maybe, who knows, maybe they would have never switched. 00:16:59.880 --> 00:17:00.380 Yeah. 00:17:00.380 --> 00:17:03.820 Did somewhere I catch that there was a limited number of developers? 00:17:03.820 --> 00:17:05.340 I think there was, like, three or something. 00:17:05.340 --> 00:17:08.620 At one point, there was three working on all these things. 00:17:08.620 --> 00:17:15.360 And, you know, microservices are often touted as being really great ways for dev teams to have autonomy. 00:17:15.360 --> 00:17:18.440 But when your dev team consists of three, you know. 00:17:18.440 --> 00:17:19.640 You don't really need autonomy. 00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:20.520 You're already autonomous. 00:17:20.520 --> 00:17:20.540 Exactly. 00:17:20.900 --> 00:17:21.540 Yeah, exactly. 00:17:21.540 --> 00:17:22.620 Like, that's one team. 00:17:22.620 --> 00:17:24.920 It doesn't need more than one thing to be autonomous, right? 00:17:24.920 --> 00:17:27.000 Generally, basically speaking. 00:17:27.000 --> 00:17:39.260 But, you know, so let me just, like, take a step back and say, for example, like, one of the big problems I said is we've got 100 different services that behave similar but not the same with slightly different integrations against different API endpoints. 00:17:39.260 --> 00:17:45.940 And we're feathering out or fanning out requests to those services based on which thing they're kind of integrated with. 00:17:45.940 --> 00:17:48.000 And the big problem was the dependencies. 00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:51.620 Well, if they had used something like Docker and Kubernetes. 00:17:51.620 --> 00:17:59.180 And they forced them all to say, we're going to install the same runtime environment with the dependencies pre-configured. 00:17:59.180 --> 00:18:09.360 And the only way you get to release a new version is you get your little thing to work with the latest image that has a uniform set of dependencies across the board. 00:18:10.060 --> 00:18:14.400 Well, that sounds like that would have completely taken out one of these problems to me, right? 00:18:14.400 --> 00:18:20.400 I mean, sure, you might have to do a little work to replace a new version of some thing, but you're keeping it in sync, right? 00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:23.200 So it seems like there's a couple of things like that that they could have done. 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:27.740 There's other issues on the testing side that were caused by these variations. 00:18:27.740 --> 00:18:31.820 And I feel like there could have been some uniformity stuff done, especially around Docker. 00:18:31.820 --> 00:18:34.400 That could have made this a lot better. 00:18:34.400 --> 00:18:37.020 But still, I think there's a lot of interesting lessons there. 00:18:37.020 --> 00:18:40.560 Yeah, I think I'm looking forward to reading this because that sounds like an interesting story. 00:18:40.560 --> 00:18:41.420 Yeah, yeah, it's pretty good. 00:18:41.420 --> 00:18:42.220 Well done. 00:18:42.220 --> 00:18:42.880 Has nice pictures. 00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:43.840 Yeah, neat. 00:18:43.840 --> 00:18:45.040 Oh, I like pictures. 00:18:45.200 --> 00:18:46.940 Speaking of tests and running them on the web. 00:18:46.940 --> 00:18:52.080 Yeah, so one of the workhorses of front-end web testing is often Selenium. 00:18:52.080 --> 00:18:56.220 And Selenium's awesome, but it can be abused. 00:18:56.220 --> 00:18:59.360 And also, it takes a little bit of knowledge. 00:18:59.360 --> 00:19:01.340 So I think we've covered others. 00:19:01.340 --> 00:19:06.820 There are some higher-level APIs that use Selenium under the hood but have a different interface. 00:19:06.820 --> 00:19:14.240 And I'm a fan of a lot of this sort of stuff because if it simplifies your life, go for it. 00:19:14.460 --> 00:19:17.040 One of the things we're going to cover today is Helium. 00:19:17.040 --> 00:19:18.340 It's a newer... 00:19:18.340 --> 00:19:19.520 Oh, it's very much newer. 00:19:19.520 --> 00:19:20.700 It's only a few months old. 00:19:20.700 --> 00:19:23.400 Python library for automating web browsers. 00:19:23.400 --> 00:19:27.240 It's a project that's built on top of Selenium. 00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:33.000 And even though it's fairly new, it's already got like over a thousand stars on GitHub. 00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:33.860 That's cool. 00:19:33.860 --> 00:19:38.120 The claim is Selenium Python 50% easier. 00:19:38.120 --> 00:19:41.940 Helium is the best Python library for web automation. 00:19:41.940 --> 00:19:43.600 Well, of course, it's saying that to itself. 00:19:43.980 --> 00:19:45.300 But it does look pretty clean. 00:19:45.300 --> 00:19:52.780 There's some pretty clean drivers to be able to control Chrome, control your browser, and navigate some stuff. 00:19:52.780 --> 00:19:54.560 So it looks good. 00:19:54.560 --> 00:19:55.540 Yeah, I really like this. 00:19:55.540 --> 00:19:58.860 I think Michael Herrmann did an interesting job on this. 00:19:58.940 --> 00:20:07.440 And the reason that I think this is neat is it takes you away from working at the structure level. 00:20:07.740 --> 00:20:12.920 So for example, just like Selenium, you say, I'm going to open up this website, right? 00:20:12.920 --> 00:20:15.700 So you say start Chrome, GitHub.com slash login. 00:20:15.960 --> 00:20:22.760 But instead of doing some kind of CSS selector to find the text box, you just say write. 00:20:22.760 --> 00:20:27.320 If you want to set something to a text box, you say write this text into. 00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:33.880 And you just, you know, give it like a short bit of text, like the label that is right before, immediately before the text box. 00:20:33.880 --> 00:20:34.680 All right. 00:20:34.680 --> 00:20:37.400 So write something into username. 00:20:37.400 --> 00:20:39.020 And that'll just fill out the username thing. 00:20:39.020 --> 00:20:40.580 Then write something into password. 00:20:41.080 --> 00:20:43.620 And that'll type in the password and then click the button. 00:20:43.620 --> 00:20:45.280 They say click sign in. 00:20:45.280 --> 00:20:47.820 And it just finds the button with the text sign in. 00:20:47.820 --> 00:20:53.760 What is nice is like what a human sees about the page is how the code interacts with it. 00:20:53.760 --> 00:20:55.940 And you might say, well, that's unstable, right? 00:20:55.940 --> 00:20:57.380 What if somebody changes the text? 00:20:57.380 --> 00:21:04.940 Well, if you've ever had to work with CSS selectors and then somebody redesigned the site and your automation stopped working, it's not a whole lot better. 00:21:04.940 --> 00:21:08.820 So you might as well make it easy for humans as far as I see it. 00:21:08.820 --> 00:21:09.140 Yeah. 00:21:09.140 --> 00:21:12.800 And the, I mean, the API is like so clean and short. 00:21:12.800 --> 00:21:22.380 So you've got like, think like function calls, like click man with, you just give it like the tag of thing, the button tag that you're going to click on. 00:21:22.380 --> 00:21:24.540 So like, yeah, it's pretty sweet. 00:21:24.540 --> 00:21:30.240 And to fill in a username, for instance, in a username field, it just is right. 00:21:30.240 --> 00:21:36.600 And then you give it two parameters that the name of the field that you're going to write into and then what you're going to write in there. 00:21:36.600 --> 00:21:38.340 So this is pretty slick. 00:21:38.420 --> 00:21:38.880 I like it. 00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:39.540 Yeah, for sure. 00:21:39.540 --> 00:21:43.880 Too many things get the for humans tag in Python, but this one kind of could get that. 00:21:43.880 --> 00:21:44.160 Yeah. 00:21:44.160 --> 00:21:46.460 And so since this is new, I'll be curious. 00:21:46.460 --> 00:21:48.920 And there's a lot of web testing going on. 00:21:48.920 --> 00:21:52.880 I'll be curious to see if, where this goes, keep an eye on it. 00:21:52.880 --> 00:21:53.500 Yeah, absolutely. 00:21:53.500 --> 00:22:02.040 And the easiest way, if you want to get a sense of like, whether or not this is interesting for you is just go watch the, there's a little GIF animated GIF. 00:22:02.100 --> 00:22:05.820 Just watch that for 10 seconds and you'll have a quick idea what you can work with there. 00:22:05.820 --> 00:22:06.940 We've said this before. 00:22:07.560 --> 00:22:12.360 The animated GIFs of how things work are a good thing to get people excited about a project. 00:22:12.360 --> 00:22:17.140 This project also includes a cheat sheet of some of the common things you might want to do. 00:22:17.140 --> 00:22:20.340 Single page with a whole bunch of stuff. 00:22:20.460 --> 00:22:25.460 It's kind of like an FAQ, but, but just sort of, no questions, just answers. 00:22:25.460 --> 00:22:26.340 Yeah. 00:22:26.340 --> 00:22:30.180 So I'm pretty certain that's a good idea, but sometimes you're not certain. 00:22:30.180 --> 00:22:31.460 Yeah. 00:22:31.460 --> 00:22:32.180 Lots of times. 00:22:32.180 --> 00:22:35.640 So I remember, I don't know where I learned more about this. 00:22:35.640 --> 00:22:40.860 Either this was in physics or this was in statistics or something. 00:22:40.860 --> 00:22:44.000 I think it was one of my science classes in college. 00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:45.200 I promptly forgotten it. 00:22:45.220 --> 00:22:49.880 So there's no way I could, could work with uncertainties and measurements really well. 00:22:49.880 --> 00:22:51.020 Maybe it was even engineering. 00:22:51.020 --> 00:22:54.620 I'll tell you a quick example and then I'll ask you a question. 00:22:54.620 --> 00:22:58.180 You can't look ahead and don't cheat because I have the answer in the notes further down. 00:22:58.180 --> 00:23:02.360 So imagine we're back in school or you're solving a real problem. 00:23:02.360 --> 00:23:04.880 Jane, she needs to calculate the volume of her pool. 00:23:04.880 --> 00:23:06.540 So she knows how much water it'll take, right? 00:23:06.540 --> 00:23:09.900 So she measures the length, the width and the height. 00:23:09.900 --> 00:23:12.640 Now, of course you can't measure it ultra precisely. 00:23:12.640 --> 00:23:14.640 And also there's probably some variation in there. 00:23:14.640 --> 00:23:20.840 So she determines the length is 5.56 meters plus or minus 2.5%. 00:23:20.840 --> 00:23:22.960 Like that's her guess on the inaccuracy. 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:25.980 And the width, 3 meters plus or minus 2.6%. 00:23:25.980 --> 00:23:29.660 And the depth, 3 meters plus or minus 3.7%. 00:23:29.660 --> 00:23:33.640 So what is the uncertainty, right? 00:23:33.640 --> 00:23:35.260 That plus or minus a little bit, that uncertainty. 00:23:35.260 --> 00:23:37.300 What is the uncertainty in the volume? 00:23:37.700 --> 00:23:40.660 Which is the length times the width times the depth. 00:23:40.660 --> 00:23:42.140 Oh, I can't even remember. 00:23:42.140 --> 00:23:42.940 Is it right? 00:23:42.940 --> 00:23:43.920 Do you multiply them together? 00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:44.680 Yeah. 00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:45.900 Do you multiply them? 00:23:45.900 --> 00:23:47.360 Do you add them? 00:23:47.360 --> 00:23:48.400 Do you average them? 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:49.420 Like what the heck? 00:23:49.420 --> 00:23:50.680 Do you take the max? 00:23:50.680 --> 00:23:51.340 I don't know. 00:23:51.340 --> 00:23:55.280 Well, there's actually very strict rules about how you do it. 00:23:55.280 --> 00:23:59.040 So when you multiply things, apparently, I didn't remember this, but I've looked it up. 00:23:59.580 --> 00:24:04.220 Apparently, you add the uncertainties when you multiply things. 00:24:04.220 --> 00:24:09.500 So in this case, it's 2.5 plus 2.6 plus 3.7 is 8.8% uncertainty. 00:24:09.500 --> 00:24:11.800 That is super tricky. 00:24:11.800 --> 00:24:20.040 And these kinds of calculations are the kind that ends up with spacecraft burrowing into like a desert or into a moon. 00:24:20.580 --> 00:24:23.040 Because they're like, oh, did we get that wrong? 00:24:23.040 --> 00:24:23.540 Whoops. 00:24:23.540 --> 00:24:24.040 Right? 00:24:24.040 --> 00:24:27.360 Did we use the wrong units or did we get the wrong uncertainty or whatever? 00:24:27.360 --> 00:24:27.680 Right? 00:24:27.680 --> 00:24:28.540 Yeah. 00:24:28.540 --> 00:24:31.280 So there's this really cool library called uncertainty. 00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:34.760 And it comes with all these different math operations. 00:24:34.760 --> 00:24:37.100 Like it has values, like a float. 00:24:37.100 --> 00:24:40.300 And it has a sine, right? 00:24:40.300 --> 00:24:42.780 Which is like, you know, sine, cosine, tangent sort of thing. 00:24:42.780 --> 00:24:45.820 So you can do mathematical computation. 00:24:45.820 --> 00:24:50.060 But instead of having a regular float, it has an uncertain float, a u float. 00:24:50.060 --> 00:24:53.800 So you create like x would say like a u float of 1 is the value. 00:24:53.800 --> 00:24:56.060 And then comma 0.1 is the uncertainty. 00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:05.680 And then if you were to do math with it and print it out, it'll say like 2 times x would be 2 plus or minus 0.2. 00:25:05.680 --> 00:25:07.900 And so it always carries its uncertainty. 00:25:07.900 --> 00:25:18.600 And then as you take like the sine of it or you multiply or you square it, it will actually integrate and consider all those different uncertainties to give you a final uncertainty in your output. 00:25:18.600 --> 00:25:19.240 Isn't that awesome? 00:25:19.240 --> 00:25:20.240 That's very cool. 00:25:20.240 --> 00:25:21.100 Yeah. 00:25:21.100 --> 00:25:23.000 This is useful in lots of fields. 00:25:23.000 --> 00:25:23.300 Yeah. 00:25:23.300 --> 00:25:28.360 If you ever have to compute with uncertainty, this seems so glorious. 00:25:28.360 --> 00:25:30.200 This and pint, right? 00:25:30.200 --> 00:25:32.780 If you could put this and pint together, then it's on. 00:25:32.780 --> 00:25:38.020 Because pint lets you work with different units of measurement and then add and multiply and divide them. 00:25:38.020 --> 00:25:40.300 And then you throw the uncertainty on top of that. 00:25:40.300 --> 00:25:41.020 Boom, you're golden. 00:25:41.020 --> 00:25:41.580 Yeah. 00:25:41.580 --> 00:25:42.700 Yeah, that'd be cool. 00:25:43.460 --> 00:25:48.360 We had worked with once with a measurement value that it was a power level for a cell phone. 00:25:48.360 --> 00:25:56.100 And the uncertainty ended up being plus or minus like the amount of power that the sun produces. 00:25:56.100 --> 00:26:01.060 So it's like we essentially don't know the answer if that's the uncertainty. 00:26:01.060 --> 00:26:02.060 Right, right, right. 00:26:02.060 --> 00:26:05.140 It could take a AA battery or it could melt the earth. 00:26:05.140 --> 00:26:06.020 We're not really sure which. 00:26:06.020 --> 00:26:07.600 We're not sure which. 00:26:07.600 --> 00:26:07.900 Yeah. 00:26:08.700 --> 00:26:10.260 Not ready for shipment yet. 00:26:10.260 --> 00:26:11.040 Exactly. 00:26:11.040 --> 00:26:13.860 Maybe we've got to get more accuracy there. 00:26:13.860 --> 00:26:20.200 Anyway, this comes from Tim Head who mentioned it on Talk Python where we recently did an episode on Binder, 00:26:20.200 --> 00:26:22.140 which is super interesting but not yet released. 00:26:22.140 --> 00:26:24.400 So eventually we'll talk more about that there as well. 00:26:24.400 --> 00:26:29.460 Anyway, uncertainty, cool little library if you've got to do any sort of computation with this kind of stuff. 00:26:29.460 --> 00:26:31.560 Yeah, I think it's cool but I'm not sure about it yet. 00:26:31.560 --> 00:26:33.220 Yeah, well, can you ever be? 00:26:33.220 --> 00:26:33.640 No. 00:26:33.640 --> 00:26:37.960 But you can be sure about the level at which you can't be sure using it. 00:26:37.960 --> 00:26:38.320 Yes. 00:26:39.280 --> 00:26:39.720 Awesome. 00:26:39.720 --> 00:26:43.060 I'm pretty sure that I wish my Python prompt was cooler. 00:26:43.060 --> 00:26:46.800 Well, I'm okay with my Python prompt. 00:26:46.800 --> 00:26:47.720 Are you? 00:26:47.720 --> 00:26:48.480 I don't know. 00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:49.200 I mean, come on. 00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:50.540 Think of all the options. 00:26:50.540 --> 00:26:55.020 You could do anything you wanted and I never thought to do that. 00:26:55.020 --> 00:26:58.240 I mean, I do it with my like a bash prompt and stuff. 00:26:58.240 --> 00:27:01.740 You know, we put our virtual environment name in there. 00:27:01.740 --> 00:27:03.080 It's stuff like that. 00:27:03.080 --> 00:27:05.040 Get status, get branch, all that kind of stuff. 00:27:05.040 --> 00:27:06.540 Yeah, definitely. 00:27:06.540 --> 00:27:07.860 So you can change those things. 00:27:07.860 --> 00:27:08.940 So why not? 00:27:08.940 --> 00:27:15.520 This article comes from, I think, Arpete Bayani and it's called Personalize Your Python Prompt. 00:27:15.520 --> 00:27:17.760 Those three right angle, right, what is it? 00:27:17.760 --> 00:27:22.680 The right, left, greater than signs that are together when you're doing interactive Python. 00:27:23.120 --> 00:27:24.660 Apparently you can muck with those. 00:27:24.660 --> 00:27:29.960 There's a sys.ps1 variable that if you sign to that, you can change it to whatever you want. 00:27:30.660 --> 00:27:38.320 And of course, the author didn't stop there. 00:27:38.320 --> 00:27:38.940 You have a non-string object. 00:27:38.940 --> 00:27:42.140 You have a non-string object to make it dynamic. 00:27:42.140 --> 00:27:49.300 So he gives a little example to where you can, and the way you do that is you have an object that has a dunder stir method. 00:27:49.660 --> 00:27:52.940 If that has dynamic action, that gets called every time. 00:27:53.000 --> 00:27:54.220 So for every prompt. 00:27:54.220 --> 00:27:55.420 So this is pretty neat. 00:27:55.420 --> 00:28:01.100 He has an example of doing some stuff, but I wanted, I didn't have time to do it this morning, but I was working on it. 00:28:01.220 --> 00:28:11.480 I was trying to get a prompt that would mimic the Windows command prompt because apparently I want that on my Mac because that would be fun. 00:28:11.480 --> 00:28:14.500 You just want to confuse people like, what are you doing? 00:28:14.500 --> 00:28:15.240 This isn't. 00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:28.200 I mean, I mean, the C colon backslash greater than was easy, but I wanted to also put the Windows, the path in there and flip the direction of the slashes and stuff like that. 00:28:28.200 --> 00:28:28.560 Yeah. 00:28:28.560 --> 00:28:28.880 Yeah. 00:28:28.880 --> 00:28:30.120 That's really cool. 00:28:30.120 --> 00:28:37.180 And I didn't, one didn't know that you could just set that, the Sys, you know, import Sys, Sys.ps1 equals something. 00:28:37.180 --> 00:28:38.200 And that now is your prompt. 00:28:38.200 --> 00:28:44.600 But I didn't really think that it could be a dynamic object like that has a stir, dunder stir. 00:28:44.600 --> 00:28:45.740 That's pretty cool. 00:28:45.740 --> 00:28:46.500 Yeah, that is neat. 00:28:46.500 --> 00:28:48.860 You could easily set up something like the Jupyter. 00:28:48.860 --> 00:28:50.740 You have Jupyter notebooks. 00:28:50.740 --> 00:28:55.200 You have bracket one, bracket two, bracket three for your various calculations, like five lines. 00:28:55.200 --> 00:28:57.300 You got that in your Python prompt if you want it. 00:28:57.620 --> 00:29:01.860 It doesn't have quite as much value because you can't change the order, but still, it's pretty interesting, I think. 00:29:01.860 --> 00:29:02.360 Yeah. 00:29:02.360 --> 00:29:03.220 Yeah, that's cool. 00:29:03.220 --> 00:29:04.180 Yeah, quite cool. 00:29:04.180 --> 00:29:04.500 All right. 00:29:04.500 --> 00:29:05.840 Well, that's a good little find. 00:29:05.840 --> 00:29:07.200 A quick and easy to play with. 00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:09.140 Well, do you have any extra stuff for us? 00:29:09.140 --> 00:29:10.020 Oh, not really. 00:29:10.020 --> 00:29:11.560 I'll go and throw one thing out for you. 00:29:11.580 --> 00:29:13.980 So, I finished my Python for Absolute Beginners course. 00:29:13.980 --> 00:29:21.980 And so, now I'm starting a new course, which is like adding a CMS to a proper data-driven web app. 00:29:21.980 --> 00:29:35.840 So, if you've got a Flask app or Pyramid or Django or something like that, and you want to let other people write part of the site, and the rest is more like Amazon would be with, you know, here's the categories, here's the products, here's the product page, and here's the review page. 00:29:35.900 --> 00:29:39.040 Like, you know, very structured, but you want to just let them like write freeform stuff. 00:29:39.040 --> 00:29:44.060 So, I'm working on a course that lets you kind of add that to existing sites. 00:29:44.060 --> 00:29:44.740 So, that'll be fun. 00:29:44.740 --> 00:29:45.960 I'm having a lot of fun working on that. 00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:46.300 Okay. 00:29:46.300 --> 00:29:47.200 Interesting. 00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:47.840 Yeah. 00:29:47.840 --> 00:29:51.760 Is this kind of where the markdown work that you were working on comes in play? 00:29:51.760 --> 00:29:52.860 Yes, exactly. 00:29:53.060 --> 00:30:08.700 So, I decided the work that I did for TalkBuyLon training to build out the landing pages and like the interesting stuff to basically make a whole section of that site just driven by markdown and just editors and whatnot. 00:30:08.700 --> 00:30:17.120 I'm going to like take that, extract it, and sort of take it to the next level like with rich markdown editors and, you know, database backends and stuff like that. 00:30:17.120 --> 00:30:17.560 It'll be fun. 00:30:17.560 --> 00:30:17.880 Nice. 00:30:17.880 --> 00:30:18.420 Okay. 00:30:18.420 --> 00:30:18.740 Cool. 00:30:18.740 --> 00:30:20.400 Shall we close it out with a limerick? 00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:21.280 Sure. 00:30:22.700 --> 00:30:25.640 I'm not very good at limericks, so I'll give this a shot. 00:30:25.640 --> 00:30:27.760 But this comes to us from Alexander A. 00:30:27.760 --> 00:30:29.360 He sent this over. 00:30:29.360 --> 00:30:30.600 He had written it. 00:30:30.600 --> 00:30:31.140 This is his. 00:30:31.140 --> 00:30:32.260 He wrote it recently. 00:30:32.260 --> 00:30:33.580 And this is submitted. 00:30:33.580 --> 00:30:36.500 Apparently, there's some kind of limerick contest at Manning. 00:30:36.500 --> 00:30:44.500 You win free content like books and whatnot if you submit a winning programming limerick. 00:30:44.500 --> 00:30:45.180 All right. 00:30:45.180 --> 00:30:45.880 So, here goes. 00:30:45.880 --> 00:30:47.420 Coding environments in three parts. 00:30:47.420 --> 00:30:49.780 To this day, some prefer BBEdit. 00:30:49.780 --> 00:30:51.800 VS Code is now getting some credit. 00:30:51.800 --> 00:30:52.660 Vim and Emacs. 00:30:52.660 --> 00:30:53.260 Vim and Emacs are fine. 00:30:53.260 --> 00:30:54.980 So are Atom and Sublime. 00:30:54.980 --> 00:30:57.320 But it doesn't matter much if you don't let it. 00:30:57.320 --> 00:30:58.100 But wait. 00:30:58.100 --> 00:30:59.720 Let's not forget IDEs. 00:30:59.720 --> 00:31:01.720 Using PyCharm sure is a breeze. 00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:04.360 Komodo, Eclipse, and Idea. 00:31:04.360 --> 00:31:06.360 Sea Lion is my panacea. 00:31:06.360 --> 00:31:08.320 And Xcode leaves me at ease. 00:31:08.320 --> 00:31:11.300 But Jupyter Notebook is also legit. 00:31:11.300 --> 00:31:13.360 Data scientists must prefer it. 00:31:13.800 --> 00:31:14.980 In the browser you code. 00:31:14.980 --> 00:31:16.400 Results are then showed. 00:31:16.400 --> 00:31:19.020 But good luck when you try to use Git. 00:31:21.720 --> 00:31:22.400 I love it. 00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:22.900 It's good, right? 00:31:22.900 --> 00:31:23.840 This is great. 00:31:23.840 --> 00:31:24.220 Yeah. 00:31:24.220 --> 00:31:24.880 Oh my gosh. 00:31:24.880 --> 00:31:25.600 It's so good. 00:31:25.600 --> 00:31:28.000 Especially that last line. 00:31:28.000 --> 00:31:28.800 I love it. 00:31:28.800 --> 00:31:30.700 Definitely makes the whole thing worth it. 00:31:30.700 --> 00:31:31.600 Yeah. 00:31:31.600 --> 00:31:33.040 Yes, indeed. 00:31:33.040 --> 00:31:35.080 So, well done, Alexander. 00:31:35.080 --> 00:31:37.240 Thanks for sharing that and letting us use it on the show. 00:31:37.240 --> 00:31:37.720 That's great. 00:31:37.720 --> 00:31:38.680 All right. 00:31:38.680 --> 00:31:39.180 Anything else? 00:31:39.180 --> 00:31:40.600 Do you got anything you want to share with folks? 00:31:40.740 --> 00:31:43.760 I guess I jumped ahead of you and did my limerick. 00:31:43.760 --> 00:31:44.480 No, no. 00:31:44.480 --> 00:31:45.400 No, it's good. 00:31:45.400 --> 00:31:49.940 We've got a whole bunch of great feedback from the recent testing code episodes. 00:31:49.940 --> 00:31:52.180 So, it's been good. 00:31:52.180 --> 00:31:52.740 Yeah. 00:31:52.740 --> 00:31:53.820 What are some of the ones? 00:31:53.820 --> 00:31:56.100 No, you just did one with Anthony Shaw. 00:31:56.100 --> 00:31:57.040 Yeah. 00:31:57.040 --> 00:31:57.620 And his plugin. 00:31:57.620 --> 00:31:58.120 Yeah. 00:31:58.120 --> 00:31:59.480 So, we talked about security. 00:31:59.480 --> 00:32:02.100 We've talked about Django recently. 00:32:02.100 --> 00:32:09.340 And just the most recent one is talking about the most downloaded pytest plugins. 00:32:10.340 --> 00:32:14.840 So, Anthony Sotili and I talked about 28 of the top plugins. 00:32:14.840 --> 00:32:16.880 That sounds like the perfect show. 00:32:16.880 --> 00:32:17.500 That's really great. 00:32:17.500 --> 00:32:17.860 Yeah. 00:32:17.860 --> 00:32:19.340 Really geeked out on a lot of stuff. 00:32:19.340 --> 00:32:22.500 I found some super interesting ones that I'm going to talk about in the next show. 00:32:22.500 --> 00:32:23.960 But we'll leave it at that. 00:32:23.960 --> 00:32:24.360 Awesome. 00:32:24.360 --> 00:32:24.940 Thanks. 00:32:24.940 --> 00:32:25.220 Cool. 00:32:25.220 --> 00:32:25.720 All right. 00:32:25.720 --> 00:32:25.980 Yeah. 00:32:25.980 --> 00:32:27.640 Well, thank you as well. 00:32:27.640 --> 00:32:29.120 Happy to be here with you like every week. 00:32:29.120 --> 00:32:29.360 Bye. 00:32:29.360 --> 00:32:29.680 Bye. 00:32:29.680 --> 00:32:31.660 Thank you for listening to Python Bytes. 00:32:31.660 --> 00:32:34.120 Follow the show on Twitter at Python Bytes. 00:32:34.120 --> 00:32:37.140 That's Python Bytes as in B-Y-T-E-S. 00:32:37.140 --> 00:32:40.040 And get the full show notes at Pythonbytes.fm. 00:32:40.040 --> 00:32:45.120 If you have a news item you want featured, just visit Pythonbytes.fm and send it our way. 00:32:45.120 --> 00:32:47.160 We're always on the lookout for sharing something cool. 00:32:47.160 --> 00:32:48.340 This is Brian Okken. 00:32:48.340 --> 00:32:52.420 And on behalf of myself and Michael Kennedy, thank you for listening and sharing this podcast 00:32:52.420 --> 00:32:53.600 with your friends and colleagues.