WEBVTT 00:00:00.001 --> 00:00:00.560 Hey, Brian. 00:00:00.560 --> 00:00:01.060 Hey. 00:00:01.060 --> 00:00:04.940 I see that you've come wielding a staff of mighty power. 00:00:04.940 --> 00:00:07.800 I was cleaning my office and I found the Python staff. 00:00:07.800 --> 00:00:09.920 So I'm like, I'm working this out for the show. 00:00:09.920 --> 00:00:12.200 Yeah, that was when we used to go to conferences. 00:00:12.200 --> 00:00:12.840 Do you remember that? 00:00:12.840 --> 00:00:14.340 Like people, they'd all get together. 00:00:14.340 --> 00:00:15.840 I think they might be making a comeback. 00:00:15.840 --> 00:00:16.780 I think so. 00:00:16.780 --> 00:00:19.760 I think I might be attending some conferences in the future. 00:00:19.760 --> 00:00:20.280 Awesome. 00:00:20.280 --> 00:00:20.840 So am I. 00:00:20.840 --> 00:00:21.520 I'm looking forward to it. 00:00:21.520 --> 00:00:22.640 Before we get to our topics, 00:00:22.640 --> 00:00:27.260 also want to say thank you to a new sponsor this week. 00:00:27.260 --> 00:00:29.640 Not totally new, but new for recent times. 00:00:30.160 --> 00:00:31.940 Compiler, the podcast from Red Hat. 00:00:31.940 --> 00:00:34.340 So awesome to have the support from Red Hat. 00:00:34.340 --> 00:00:36.880 We're going to be telling you more about them later. 00:00:36.880 --> 00:00:38.920 But Brian, let's just mix it up. 00:00:38.920 --> 00:00:39.620 Let's make it different. 00:00:39.620 --> 00:00:42.660 This is episode 308, recorded November 1st, 2022. 00:00:42.660 --> 00:00:43.620 I'm Michael Kennedy. 00:00:43.620 --> 00:00:44.660 And I'm Brian Okken. 00:00:44.660 --> 00:00:46.020 Let's do it. 00:00:46.020 --> 00:00:47.920 I did want to talk about PyCon. 00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:50.540 Yeah, so PyCon is coming up. 00:00:50.540 --> 00:00:52.040 So when is it? 00:00:52.040 --> 00:00:56.160 I wrote this down even so I could remember. 00:00:56.160 --> 00:00:58.320 It's April 19th to the 23rd. 00:00:58.640 --> 00:01:05.560 But we bring up PyCon US because the site just launched recently. 00:01:05.560 --> 00:01:07.120 So pretty excited about that. 00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:12.220 Linking to a blog post about the site launch and the call for proposals. 00:01:12.220 --> 00:01:16.260 So again, it's going to be, let's just hop over to the big one. 00:01:16.260 --> 00:01:19.080 It's kind of a cool look to it now. 00:01:19.580 --> 00:01:25.680 It's an homage to some of the old ones because there's, what's the 20th anniversary special? 00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:27.600 So it's some of the old pictures. 00:01:27.600 --> 00:01:28.700 So you can try to see. 00:01:28.700 --> 00:01:28.800 Oh, I see. 00:01:28.800 --> 00:01:30.120 So it's a bunch of tiles. 00:01:30.120 --> 00:01:34.020 And the different tiles are actually like the hero image or whatever. 00:01:34.020 --> 00:01:34.620 Yeah. 00:01:34.620 --> 00:01:35.440 From that year. 00:01:35.440 --> 00:01:37.760 Or bits of it or something. 00:01:37.760 --> 00:01:38.460 Yeah. 00:01:38.900 --> 00:01:40.780 It looks cool. 00:01:40.780 --> 00:01:45.300 So PyCon US is going to be April 19th to the 23rd. 00:01:45.300 --> 00:01:46.560 Well, that's when the talks are. 00:01:46.560 --> 00:01:47.540 It's longer. 00:01:47.740 --> 00:01:49.740 So there's tutorials ahead of time. 00:01:49.740 --> 00:01:53.700 And then there's hack days or whatever you call those afterwards. 00:01:53.700 --> 00:01:56.360 So if you can stay longer, awesome. 00:01:56.360 --> 00:01:58.820 But the talk part is the 19th through the 23rd. 00:01:58.820 --> 00:01:59.560 Salt Lake City. 00:02:00.340 --> 00:02:02.120 The site looks great. 00:02:02.120 --> 00:02:04.260 The call for proposals is up. 00:02:04.260 --> 00:02:09.320 And that's really kind of what I wanted to highlight is so people start thinking about your talks. 00:02:09.320 --> 00:02:15.580 And of course, yeah, we've got some more information about talks coming up later in the show. 00:02:15.580 --> 00:02:18.120 But the deadlines, what are the deadlines? 00:02:18.120 --> 00:02:21.880 So we've got the CFP just opened, just opened the 18th. 00:02:21.880 --> 00:02:25.120 And then it's through December 9th. 00:02:25.120 --> 00:02:27.500 So, but don't wait until December. 00:02:27.500 --> 00:02:28.960 Get those in early. 00:02:29.320 --> 00:02:30.320 So anyway. 00:02:30.320 --> 00:02:31.220 Yeah, excellent. 00:02:31.220 --> 00:02:35.160 I think I'm going to submit some because I kind of think I want to go to PyCon this year. 00:02:35.160 --> 00:02:36.700 I didn't go last year. 00:02:36.700 --> 00:02:39.200 Have you thought about it yet, Michael? 00:02:39.200 --> 00:02:40.540 Yeah, I've definitely thought about it. 00:02:40.540 --> 00:02:42.340 I'm very much considering going. 00:02:42.340 --> 00:02:48.200 You know, for me, it's like, is Talk Python going to get a booth and have like a bunch of presence there? 00:02:48.200 --> 00:02:53.040 In which case, going to the conference means hanging out at the booth for three days, which is kind of awesome. 00:02:53.040 --> 00:02:55.120 But also, it's like not exactly a conference. 00:02:55.120 --> 00:02:59.200 Maybe I'll go low key and submit a talk and then just like cruise around the hall. 00:02:59.300 --> 00:03:00.200 I haven't decided. 00:03:00.200 --> 00:03:00.660 Right. 00:03:00.660 --> 00:03:02.660 Do a bunch of podcast recording live there. 00:03:02.660 --> 00:03:02.840 Right. 00:03:02.840 --> 00:03:04.760 So there's there's tradeoffs to both, obviously. 00:03:04.760 --> 00:03:07.200 So I got to got to think about what I might want to do. 00:03:07.200 --> 00:03:10.080 Yeah, I think I'm going to submit some talks. 00:03:10.180 --> 00:03:17.540 One of the things I wanted to bring up with submitting talks is to not to do it because it's a good experience to submit a talk. 00:03:17.540 --> 00:03:22.280 Even if you don't get the talk, it's the process of going through that submittal process. 00:03:22.280 --> 00:03:27.480 I think it's it's it's a growing growth experience, even if even if it gets rejected. 00:03:27.480 --> 00:03:33.140 And don't feel bad because tons of people submit talks and they can't accept all of them, obviously. 00:03:33.440 --> 00:03:33.940 So, yeah. 00:03:33.940 --> 00:03:34.380 Yeah. 00:03:34.380 --> 00:03:35.060 Absolutely. 00:03:35.060 --> 00:03:35.720 Cool. 00:03:35.720 --> 00:03:36.160 Cool. 00:03:36.160 --> 00:03:36.660 Yeah. 00:03:36.660 --> 00:03:37.800 That'd be exciting. 00:03:37.800 --> 00:03:41.260 I actually want to do a bit of bookkeeping before we move on. 00:03:41.260 --> 00:03:42.420 Yeah, it's a good idea. 00:03:42.420 --> 00:03:47.880 For people who typically attend our live stream recording, which we really appreciate that. 00:03:47.880 --> 00:03:48.440 That's awesome. 00:03:48.900 --> 00:03:58.120 We see a bunch of familiar faces in the chat already out here and we do that live on YouTube and then we polish it up and send it out to the world over the audio channels. 00:03:58.120 --> 00:04:01.740 So I think you can get a lot out of the video version. 00:04:01.740 --> 00:04:04.400 That said, we're moving the video version, right? 00:04:04.400 --> 00:04:05.280 We are. 00:04:05.280 --> 00:04:06.660 And it's my fault. 00:04:06.660 --> 00:04:15.340 So I've got a periodic meeting that happens in my day job and it happens at noon on Tuesdays. 00:04:15.340 --> 00:04:17.600 And that's when we usually used to record. 00:04:17.600 --> 00:04:19.500 So we're just shifting it a little bit. 00:04:19.500 --> 00:04:22.220 So we're going to do 11 a.m. on Tuesdays. 00:04:22.220 --> 00:04:22.740 Exactly. 00:04:22.740 --> 00:04:25.460 It's just an hour earlier on Tuesdays. 00:04:25.460 --> 00:04:32.320 So I want to encourage people to go to Python Bytes.fm slash YouTube and it'll take you over to our channel. 00:04:32.320 --> 00:04:36.960 If you subscribe and get notified, you'll just get a pop up when we're streaming live. 00:04:36.960 --> 00:04:38.120 And if you've got time, you can drop it. 00:04:38.120 --> 00:04:39.440 You don't have to plan too much about it. 00:04:39.440 --> 00:04:47.000 So anyway, encourage people to be part of the YouTube experience here because we put a lot of stuff on the screen and it makes it even a little bit cooler, I think. 00:04:47.460 --> 00:04:53.900 And while we're bookkeeping and it's 11, if you can make it 11 a.m. on Tuesdays, maybe you want to be on the show. 00:04:53.900 --> 00:04:56.040 So reach out if you'd like to be a guest host. 00:04:56.040 --> 00:04:57.140 We still do those. 00:04:57.140 --> 00:04:58.380 Yeah, exactly. 00:04:58.380 --> 00:04:59.060 I do. 00:04:59.060 --> 00:05:00.580 I wonder if I've got anything to talk about. 00:05:00.580 --> 00:05:00.880 Let's see. 00:05:00.880 --> 00:05:01.740 How about NEIO? 00:05:01.740 --> 00:05:06.500 NEIO is a framework that lets you build async things. 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:13.100 And when you first hear about it, it looks like it's kind of for making network libraries. 00:05:13.100 --> 00:05:20.800 Like if you were making a low-level network app and you wanted it to be concurrent and asynchronous, like, well, you could use NEIO, which would be cool. 00:05:20.880 --> 00:05:24.700 And it has the ability to be, how did Alex, the creator of it, put it? 00:05:24.700 --> 00:05:28.720 Something like a framework that goes above the asyncio frameworks. 00:05:28.720 --> 00:05:35.340 So it doesn't, like, if you think of Trio or Curio, those are replacements for asyncio. 00:05:35.520 --> 00:05:41.800 Whereas NEIO will run on top and integrate with asyncio, or it will run on top of and integrate with Trio. 00:05:41.800 --> 00:05:45.680 So you can kind of add it into whatever you're doing, which I think is pretty sweet. 00:05:45.680 --> 00:05:50.500 But I think its little elevator pitch or whatever here sells it a bit short. 00:05:50.500 --> 00:05:57.980 So I just wanted to talk about some awesome building blocks that people can use from NEIO that I think would make it really fun. 00:05:57.980 --> 00:06:04.980 All right, so one of the 3.11 features actually is this idea of task groups. 00:06:04.980 --> 00:06:14.180 And they also have this concept of task groups over, they had it originally in Trio, and then it comes over here about these groups. 00:06:14.180 --> 00:06:22.180 And what you can do is you can basically create a task group, do a bunch of work on them, and then when it exits that width block, it's all finished. 00:06:22.180 --> 00:06:27.480 So if you're not ready to go to 3.11, but you want to have task groups, here's one way to get it. 00:06:27.520 --> 00:06:29.060 So that's one thing that's kind of cool. 00:06:29.060 --> 00:06:34.060 It supports cancellation and timeout, which is important, especially as a group of related things. 00:06:34.060 --> 00:06:39.140 But one of the things I want to touch on here that's pretty cool is the synchronization primitives. 00:06:39.140 --> 00:06:44.580 Remember a few weeks ago, Guido wrote that article about people at a table and semaphores and stuff? 00:06:44.580 --> 00:06:45.000 Yeah. 00:06:45.000 --> 00:06:46.160 Yeah, so... 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:46.500 That's the thing. 00:06:46.500 --> 00:06:47.420 Yeah, exactly. 00:06:47.420 --> 00:06:51.120 So there's a couple of those types of primitives here that are really neat. 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:59.640 So they've got events, which allow you to just run up to a point and wait until some other asyncio thing comes along and says, now go. 00:06:59.640 --> 00:07:06.560 And these are similar to the events that are built into the standard library, but they're not reentrant. 00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:07.660 And they have a little bit... 00:07:07.660 --> 00:07:13.820 They claim to have a better way of presenting a race condition, a little bit closer to Trio. 00:07:13.820 --> 00:07:15.120 So there's those. 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:18.520 And one of the ones over here that's cool is capacity limiters. 00:07:18.520 --> 00:07:20.160 I think I did talk about this one before. 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:24.460 So you can go over here and just say, I want to only do... 00:07:24.460 --> 00:07:26.500 In this case, the example says, create a capacity limiter two. 00:07:26.500 --> 00:07:27.800 I only want to do two things at a time. 00:07:27.800 --> 00:07:28.580 But yeah. 00:07:29.580 --> 00:07:30.880 Then, let's see. 00:07:30.880 --> 00:07:33.500 Another one is this working with threads. 00:07:33.500 --> 00:07:34.240 Pretty awesome. 00:07:34.240 --> 00:07:36.020 So you can... 00:07:36.020 --> 00:07:44.060 Given some function that is just a regular function, you can turn it into async, but actually have it execute on a background thread with two thread. 00:07:44.060 --> 00:07:44.620 Wow. 00:07:44.620 --> 00:07:45.000 Give it that. 00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:49.100 And then you can await it just like other things that mix into your asyncio world. 00:07:49.100 --> 00:07:50.980 You can also do it in reverse. 00:07:50.980 --> 00:07:57.280 If you're over in a thread and you need to run it on the async event loop, you can also push it. 00:07:57.280 --> 00:07:59.120 You can say from thread and to thread. 00:07:59.420 --> 00:08:00.520 The two thread is the... 00:08:00.520 --> 00:08:01.260 I believe the one that... 00:08:01.260 --> 00:08:02.600 Now the from thread will push it back. 00:08:02.600 --> 00:08:04.360 Back to the async event loop, which is cool. 00:08:04.360 --> 00:08:05.780 Let's see. 00:08:05.780 --> 00:08:09.060 Also, subprocesses are pretty awesome. 00:08:09.060 --> 00:08:10.980 So you can do... 00:08:10.980 --> 00:08:17.500 Like you have this idea of running your code in a thread because it's not async, but you want it to be kind of concurrent and mix it in. 00:08:17.500 --> 00:08:19.140 You can do the same thing with subprocess. 00:08:19.140 --> 00:08:20.320 And this is super cool. 00:08:20.320 --> 00:08:26.480 So you can say just run process and then it becomes something that's a task that you can await along with your other things. 00:08:26.480 --> 00:08:26.980 Nice. 00:08:26.980 --> 00:08:27.400 Which is sweet. 00:08:27.620 --> 00:08:33.500 And then you can even go as far as to open the process and then like asynchronously work with it. 00:08:33.500 --> 00:08:41.560 So here's an example of where you open some process and then you create a text receive stream from its standard out and you just cruise around and read from it while it's running. 00:08:41.560 --> 00:08:42.820 Awaiting all the time. 00:08:42.820 --> 00:08:43.360 Wow. 00:08:43.360 --> 00:08:44.220 That's neat, right? 00:08:44.480 --> 00:08:44.800 Yeah. 00:08:44.800 --> 00:08:48.440 So it just grabs it while it's printing out? 00:08:48.440 --> 00:08:49.460 Yeah. 00:08:49.460 --> 00:08:58.300 So basically what I think it does is it creates a stream that you can await and then it's just listening for process messages to come through. 00:08:58.300 --> 00:09:02.020 And then it, you know, like the task kind of partially completes, right? 00:09:02.020 --> 00:09:03.940 Because it's an async for loop. 00:09:04.260 --> 00:09:08.620 So you asynchronously wait for an item to come in and then it kicks it one time around the loop and then it waits again. 00:09:08.620 --> 00:09:10.620 And yeah, it's pretty cool how it juggles that. 00:09:10.620 --> 00:09:10.980 Yeah. 00:09:11.140 --> 00:09:15.680 And then finally here, the file support. 00:09:15.680 --> 00:09:22.940 So you can now, instead of saying open, you just say any IO dot open file, but you can async await it. 00:09:22.940 --> 00:09:24.420 You know, it's crazy. 00:09:24.420 --> 00:09:25.500 Async with await. 00:09:25.500 --> 00:09:27.080 There's a lot of crazy stuff happening. 00:09:27.080 --> 00:09:29.180 But then you can await the reads and so on. 00:09:29.260 --> 00:09:33.220 Now there's not actual asynchronous behavior in Python. 00:09:33.220 --> 00:09:34.940 So how does it manage this? 00:09:34.940 --> 00:09:39.740 Basically, it creates a wrapper that uses threads that does the file IO. 00:09:39.740 --> 00:09:44.400 And then it just sort of coordinates the communication of the IO back and forth on the threads. 00:09:44.400 --> 00:09:49.500 As soon as it comes back from IO, which should release the GIL because it's off doing its own thing in the OS. 00:09:49.500 --> 00:09:50.820 So it should be pretty good anyway. 00:09:50.820 --> 00:10:02.200 It looks like maybe I haven't used this, but it looks like it makes things like subprocesses and threads and normal async and await all kind of look the same. 00:10:02.200 --> 00:10:03.560 Yeah, exactly. 00:10:03.560 --> 00:10:08.520 It's like a unifying API across the different scenarios, which is really cool. 00:10:08.520 --> 00:10:10.980 Once you kind of wrap it, you're like, oh, there's just a bunch of tasks. 00:10:10.980 --> 00:10:12.660 I just call await on them. 00:10:12.660 --> 00:10:13.240 Good to go. 00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:13.720 Nice. 00:10:13.720 --> 00:10:21.100 And then possibly it wouldn't be too much if you had to change your mind and have something be a subprocess or a thread. 00:10:21.100 --> 00:10:24.640 Instead, it might not wreak havoc on your design too much. 00:10:24.640 --> 00:10:25.520 Yeah, exactly. 00:10:25.520 --> 00:10:27.560 You almost don't even have to worry about it. 00:10:27.560 --> 00:10:31.780 As long as the parameters can be passed, right? 00:10:31.780 --> 00:10:36.300 They've got to be pick a little bowl to go across the wire there. 00:10:36.300 --> 00:10:43.100 But as long as they can be passed to the process as well as to a thread, then you just get a task back that talks to you. 00:10:43.100 --> 00:10:43.360 It's cool. 00:10:43.360 --> 00:10:45.000 I'll definitely take a look at this. 00:10:45.000 --> 00:10:51.320 Just before I move off of this, I just want to say also I interviewed Alex Grunholm over on Talk Python. 00:10:51.320 --> 00:10:52.700 When was that? 00:10:52.700 --> 00:10:53.540 September. 00:10:53.540 --> 00:10:55.280 Actually released it in October, though. 00:10:55.280 --> 00:10:58.800 So effectively October or a couple weeks ago. 00:10:58.800 --> 00:11:02.960 And people can check that out if they want to dive deep into it and hear that story. 00:11:02.960 --> 00:11:04.820 Anyway, I feel like, yeah, yeah. 00:11:04.820 --> 00:11:05.260 Thanks. 00:11:05.260 --> 00:11:07.620 I do just feel like any I.O. sells itself a bit short. 00:11:07.620 --> 00:11:09.320 Say, no, it's like a network library. 00:11:09.320 --> 00:11:10.920 Like, oh, I don't need a network library. 00:11:10.920 --> 00:11:13.380 But no, there's like all these little cool building blocks in there. 00:11:13.380 --> 00:11:14.080 Pretty cool. 00:11:14.080 --> 00:11:15.260 Have you used it? 00:11:15.260 --> 00:11:16.980 Is it pretty nice to use? 00:11:16.980 --> 00:11:18.220 I've not used it. 00:11:18.220 --> 00:11:18.660 Okay. 00:11:18.660 --> 00:11:30.080 I'm still working on getting my interesting projects more async capable, you know, before, like, for example, getting some of the web stuff in the front end can be more async and so on. 00:11:30.080 --> 00:11:33.800 Then I can start bringing these fun ideas in more on real projects. 00:11:34.220 --> 00:11:35.500 Back to your topic real quick. 00:11:35.500 --> 00:11:42.460 Brandon and Audien says, if one was looking at submitting to PyCon, what's the difference between a tutorial versus a talk? 00:11:42.460 --> 00:11:43.080 Time? 00:11:43.080 --> 00:11:43.880 What else, Brian? 00:11:43.880 --> 00:11:44.940 Hands on exercises? 00:11:44.940 --> 00:11:45.260 Right. 00:11:45.380 --> 00:11:48.440 So, tutorials are, what, like three hours or something? 00:11:48.440 --> 00:11:49.780 I can't remember how long they are. 00:11:49.780 --> 00:11:53.020 And, okay, so they're three hours. 00:11:53.020 --> 00:11:54.080 They're also at a different time. 00:11:54.080 --> 00:11:55.660 So, they're like not on the same day. 00:11:55.660 --> 00:11:56.500 The day before or something. 00:11:56.500 --> 00:11:59.480 I mean, I think they're like two or three days before. 00:11:59.480 --> 00:12:01.920 I can't remember how many days before they run them. 00:12:01.920 --> 00:12:02.880 I should have looked this up. 00:12:02.880 --> 00:12:03.080 Yeah. 00:12:03.300 --> 00:12:04.360 But they're before the conference. 00:12:04.360 --> 00:12:08.100 So, you have to, you have more hotel tickets to get, for instance. 00:12:08.100 --> 00:12:11.100 But since it's three hours and a talk is what? 00:12:11.100 --> 00:12:12.720 Like 25 minutes or something? 00:12:12.720 --> 00:12:13.040 25 minutes, yeah. 00:12:13.040 --> 00:12:13.140 Half hour? 00:12:13.140 --> 00:12:18.000 Since there are more work to prepare for a tutorial, you get paid for them. 00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:19.760 You get a little stipend. 00:12:19.960 --> 00:12:23.240 But also, people have to pay to talk, go to the tutorial. 00:12:23.240 --> 00:12:24.140 So, you know. 00:12:24.140 --> 00:12:26.180 But I think there are cool things. 00:12:26.180 --> 00:12:30.780 I know a handful of the people we know do like to do tutorials if they can. 00:12:30.780 --> 00:12:31.640 Yeah. 00:12:31.640 --> 00:12:36.800 I think it's also a lot more guiding people through hands-on coding than it is, I'm here 00:12:36.800 --> 00:12:37.580 to like present. 00:12:37.580 --> 00:12:38.180 Yeah. 00:12:38.180 --> 00:12:38.960 It's not a three hour. 00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:40.680 It shouldn't be a three hour presentation. 00:12:40.680 --> 00:12:45.220 It's like, we're going to present something and then have exercises for people to work on. 00:12:45.220 --> 00:12:47.400 People bring their laptops in and stuff like that. 00:12:47.400 --> 00:12:48.000 Yeah. 00:12:48.000 --> 00:12:48.540 Yeah. 00:12:48.960 --> 00:12:52.460 But then there's also, one of the things that people forget about is posters. 00:12:52.460 --> 00:12:53.860 Posters are also pretty cool. 00:12:53.860 --> 00:12:59.580 On the last day of the, on Sunday, I think it's on Sunday, they have the posters up. 00:12:59.580 --> 00:13:01.200 The posters and the job fair, right? 00:13:01.200 --> 00:13:02.240 Yeah, I think so. 00:13:02.240 --> 00:13:03.840 The job fair and the posters at the same time. 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:06.260 And it really literally is a poster. 00:13:06.260 --> 00:13:12.020 So that if you get one of the poster spots, you get a section where you get to have your 00:13:12.020 --> 00:13:15.360 poster up and you can describe whatever you want on there. 00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:18.180 Hopefully it's fairly entertaining to look at and read. 00:13:18.180 --> 00:13:19.440 And then you get to hang out. 00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:22.700 So let's say you've got a project you want to talk to people about. 00:13:22.700 --> 00:13:24.260 It's not really a presentation. 00:13:24.260 --> 00:13:28.120 You have your poster up and you just hang out there and then people come around and ask you 00:13:28.120 --> 00:13:28.560 questions. 00:13:28.560 --> 00:13:29.000 Yeah. 00:13:29.000 --> 00:13:29.480 That's pretty neat. 00:13:29.480 --> 00:13:29.840 Absolutely. 00:13:29.840 --> 00:13:30.260 Yeah. 00:13:30.260 --> 00:13:30.600 Yeah. 00:13:30.600 --> 00:13:33.540 If you want to have a chance to just have a conversation around something you're working 00:13:33.540 --> 00:13:35.540 on, but not go all in on a talk. 00:13:35.540 --> 00:13:37.240 I tried to submit a keynote once. 00:13:37.240 --> 00:13:38.240 Turns out you can't do it. 00:13:38.640 --> 00:13:40.780 Oh, are they, do they ask people or something? 00:13:40.780 --> 00:13:42.420 Keynotes are invite only, Michael. 00:13:42.420 --> 00:13:43.480 You can't submit a keynote. 00:13:43.480 --> 00:13:44.920 I'm like, well, I'm submitting one. 00:13:44.920 --> 00:13:46.240 You can turn it down if you want. 00:13:46.240 --> 00:13:47.360 They did. 00:13:47.360 --> 00:13:47.860 It's all right. 00:13:47.860 --> 00:13:49.020 Okay. 00:13:49.300 --> 00:13:51.320 Now, I want to tell you about one more thing. 00:13:51.320 --> 00:13:51.680 Awesome. 00:13:51.680 --> 00:13:53.520 One awesome thing before we move on, Brian. 00:13:53.520 --> 00:13:57.200 I'll tell you about compiler podcasts from Red Hat. 00:13:57.480 --> 00:14:01.480 So super cool to have Red Hat come along and supporting the show. 00:14:01.480 --> 00:14:06.000 And, you know, like pretty much everyone listening, you and I were fans of podcasts. 00:14:06.000 --> 00:14:10.380 And so it's awesome to have this compiler from Red Hat supporting the show. 00:14:10.380 --> 00:14:12.700 Really, really good show that they have themselves. 00:14:12.700 --> 00:14:14.700 It's very highly edited and polished. 00:14:14.700 --> 00:14:15.780 So that's excellent. 00:14:15.780 --> 00:14:20.140 If you want to stay on top of tech without dedicating tons of time to it, you can listen 00:14:20.140 --> 00:14:20.620 to compiler. 00:14:20.620 --> 00:14:25.220 They present different perspectives and topics and insights from the tech industry, free from 00:14:25.220 --> 00:14:26.360 jargon and judgment. 00:14:26.660 --> 00:14:30.900 They want to discover where technology is headed beyond the headlines and create a place for 00:14:30.900 --> 00:14:33.320 new IT professionals to learn, grow and thrive. 00:14:33.320 --> 00:14:38.020 They help people break through barriers and challenges, turning code into community at all 00:14:38.020 --> 00:14:39.220 the levels of the enterprise. 00:14:39.220 --> 00:14:43.580 One recent interesting episode is the one about the great stack debate. 00:14:43.580 --> 00:14:48.040 I love, love, love talking about, talking to people about their architecture and the trade 00:14:48.040 --> 00:14:52.840 ops and choices that they made and what the costs and challenges and, you know, it smiled 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:54.100 and frowns that result from that. 00:14:54.100 --> 00:14:56.500 So you can definitely check out the great stack debate. 00:14:56.640 --> 00:14:57.140 That's a fun one. 00:14:57.140 --> 00:15:01.980 They answer the question of whether software is like an onion or like it's lasagna or whether 00:15:01.980 --> 00:15:04.060 it's some other more complicated dish. 00:15:04.060 --> 00:15:05.080 So you can check that. 00:15:05.080 --> 00:15:05.600 That's a lot of fun. 00:15:05.600 --> 00:15:06.740 And it's actually first. 00:15:06.740 --> 00:15:07.280 Yeah, go ahead. 00:15:07.280 --> 00:15:09.840 Looks like the most recent one is about testing, too. 00:15:09.840 --> 00:15:11.180 I better check that out. 00:15:11.180 --> 00:15:11.620 Yeah. 00:15:11.620 --> 00:15:12.500 You got to get in there. 00:15:12.500 --> 00:15:17.200 They have a whole series on the compiler, the compiler series on software stacks. 00:15:17.200 --> 00:15:19.320 And I guess testing is an important part of that. 00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:19.620 It's awesome. 00:15:19.620 --> 00:15:20.040 Yeah. 00:15:20.080 --> 00:15:23.560 So learn about compiler at pythonbytes.fm/compiler. 00:15:23.560 --> 00:15:25.540 The link is in your podcast player show notes. 00:15:25.540 --> 00:15:31.820 I know you could just search for compiler and sign up, but follow the link and click on your podcast player there and subscribe. 00:15:31.820 --> 00:15:35.920 That way it would really help us let them know that you heard about them from us. 00:15:35.960 --> 00:15:38.740 So thanks to compiler for keeping this show going strong. 00:15:38.740 --> 00:15:39.780 All right, Brian, what's next? 00:15:39.780 --> 00:15:42.680 Well, I was going to talk about conference talks. 00:15:42.680 --> 00:15:45.980 So some more. 00:15:45.980 --> 00:15:54.000 So I think everybody should try because I actually I I was terrified to do my first talk and I think it was a good experience. 00:15:54.000 --> 00:16:04.040 So Reuven Lerner, Reuven Lerner, friend of the show and all around awesome guy, wrote an article called how to propose a winning conference talk. 00:16:04.040 --> 00:16:05.380 So we're linking to that. 00:16:05.380 --> 00:16:08.800 And what there's a lot of there's a lot of articles on how to do a talk. 00:16:08.800 --> 00:16:11.880 And what I like, what I really like about this is it's short. 00:16:11.880 --> 00:16:16.480 There's a there's a few things that he focuses on. 00:16:16.920 --> 00:16:24.440 One of the first is like coming up with ideas and he like part of his audience is also other trainers. 00:16:24.440 --> 00:16:28.560 So but I think that more people are trainers than you realize. 00:16:28.560 --> 00:16:35.220 So maybe you're maybe you actually teach people like Reuven does or, you know, you have a training gig. 00:16:35.220 --> 00:16:46.100 But you could teach mentor or lead or coach in other ways just by being the resident Python guy or girl or woman or whatever at your company. 00:16:46.100 --> 00:16:47.620 And when people come to you and ask questions. 00:16:47.620 --> 00:16:51.760 So one of the some of those things are to come up with a list of things to talk about. 00:16:51.760 --> 00:16:54.280 What questions do people ask you all the time? 00:16:54.280 --> 00:16:56.380 Those are great things to break talks about. 00:16:56.380 --> 00:17:02.060 Maybe what knowledge, what knowledge do you think people should have that they just don't know to ask about? 00:17:02.060 --> 00:17:03.720 Those are also great topics. 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:08.460 And then also, where do you see that people just don't seem to get it? 00:17:08.460 --> 00:17:11.340 And so somehow they're not getting some concept. 00:17:11.340 --> 00:17:14.160 They don't quite get it from whatever they've sought out. 00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:15.400 Those are also great things. 00:17:15.400 --> 00:17:20.060 And if and if that if you're still stumped, he says, well, check out Stack Overflow. 00:17:20.060 --> 00:17:22.100 What kind of questions come up there all the time? 00:17:22.100 --> 00:17:24.980 Those are those are good things to maybe give a talk about. 00:17:24.980 --> 00:17:27.400 So, hey, I got a cheat code for people listening. 00:17:27.400 --> 00:17:27.960 OK. 00:17:27.960 --> 00:17:31.840 What awesome thing did you hear about on Python bytes that was like new to you? 00:17:31.840 --> 00:17:33.480 And there's not a talk at the conference. 00:17:33.480 --> 00:17:34.120 I'm serious. 00:17:34.120 --> 00:17:35.560 Yeah, exactly. 00:17:35.800 --> 00:17:35.920 Yeah. 00:17:35.920 --> 00:17:40.820 You know, rewind a handful of episodes and go through and go, that sounds interesting. 00:17:40.820 --> 00:17:44.440 And, you know, spend a few hours researching it and come up with a talk. 00:17:44.440 --> 00:17:44.840 Why not? 00:17:44.840 --> 00:17:45.240 Right. 00:17:45.240 --> 00:17:45.400 Right. 00:17:45.400 --> 00:17:46.540 It's interesting to me. 00:17:46.540 --> 00:17:47.160 I want to learn it. 00:17:47.160 --> 00:17:48.200 And then I could present it. 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:50.240 You know, you could test drive these things. 00:17:50.460 --> 00:17:51.980 So it's smaller regional conferences. 00:17:51.980 --> 00:17:54.400 You could test drive them at meetups. 00:17:54.400 --> 00:17:58.340 You could test drive them as like a YouTube video that you post somewhere or even a blog 00:17:58.340 --> 00:17:58.820 post you write. 00:17:58.820 --> 00:18:02.840 Like there's a bunch of let me take a shot at it and then build some confidence and then 00:18:02.840 --> 00:18:06.080 submit it to PyCon US or Europe or wherever. 00:18:06.080 --> 00:18:06.640 Yeah. 00:18:06.640 --> 00:18:11.600 He goes on to talk about using an outline. 00:18:11.600 --> 00:18:19.700 And even if you don't go for a talk, maybe I don't remember if I think PyCon US does ask 00:18:19.700 --> 00:18:21.260 for this, but some don't. 00:18:21.260 --> 00:18:25.000 But even if it's not asked for, come up with an outline with times. 00:18:25.000 --> 00:18:26.820 And that part freaked me out. 00:18:26.820 --> 00:18:28.320 I'm like, how do I do that? 00:18:28.320 --> 00:18:32.100 But his example is fairly not scary. 00:18:32.100 --> 00:18:35.860 It's kind of the bullet points of the sort of stuff you're going to talk about. 00:18:35.860 --> 00:18:38.240 And how long you intend to talk about it. 00:18:38.240 --> 00:18:40.480 And this is actually really important. 00:18:40.480 --> 00:18:44.560 I, when I, when I finally embraced this and went, I got to think about this. 00:18:44.560 --> 00:18:49.640 And I kind of do this hand in hand with this, the next step, the next step, he said, is you 00:18:49.640 --> 00:18:52.700 don't just need an outline. 00:18:52.700 --> 00:18:56.680 You need a summary and you kind of need a short summary and a long summary possibly. 00:18:56.680 --> 00:19:03.200 And that's, and you should include, I can't remember where he wrote this down, but you 00:19:03.200 --> 00:19:05.280 should include, what is it? 00:19:05.280 --> 00:19:10.440 the value that people get, what benefit they'll get from your talk and what knowledge 00:19:10.440 --> 00:19:14.860 they'll get, what they'll have when they leave your talk and how will that help them? 00:19:14.860 --> 00:19:16.440 And think about those. 00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:20.260 And that while you're putting through your, your outline together too, as to where you 00:19:20.260 --> 00:19:24.520 want to spend your time and, you know, be paying attention that you do want to have some, 00:19:24.520 --> 00:19:26.240 some wrap up time possibly. 00:19:26.660 --> 00:19:29.160 And you might want some introduction time. 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:31.400 So include that and think about those times. 00:19:31.400 --> 00:19:35.760 And then you've got just these little tiny one or two minute, one or two or three or four 00:19:35.760 --> 00:19:38.600 minute segments that you've got to come up with words for. 00:19:39.260 --> 00:19:45.420 And that's actually a lot easier to deal with than thinking I got to come up with 25 minutes. 00:19:45.420 --> 00:19:46.200 Right. 00:19:46.200 --> 00:19:46.920 So yeah. 00:19:46.920 --> 00:19:49.760 Like an example here, it says generate warnings, two minutes. 00:19:49.760 --> 00:19:52.220 Could you spend two minutes talking about generating warnings? 00:19:52.220 --> 00:19:53.560 I imagine you could. 00:19:53.560 --> 00:19:55.260 Yeah. 00:19:55.420 --> 00:19:58.640 And if it's important, put throw, throw some time into it. 00:19:58.640 --> 00:20:03.980 But the, the, one of the things I wanted to highlight on this, I really liked this write 00:20:03.980 --> 00:20:04.300 up. 00:20:04.300 --> 00:20:05.780 He also, a couple more things. 00:20:05.780 --> 00:20:08.820 One is submit the same talk to multiple conferences. 00:20:08.820 --> 00:20:10.200 You can do that. 00:20:10.200 --> 00:20:12.700 And you don't even have, it doesn't even have to be new. 00:20:12.700 --> 00:20:17.640 You could have already submitted, presented it somewhere and it might already be on YouTube. 00:20:17.640 --> 00:20:19.540 And you're like, really? 00:20:19.540 --> 00:20:20.580 I can do that. 00:20:20.580 --> 00:20:21.500 Yes, really. 00:20:21.500 --> 00:20:22.320 You can do that. 00:20:22.460 --> 00:20:25.620 some people give talks at multiple conferences and it's fine. 00:20:25.620 --> 00:20:28.060 You don't have to come up with a brand new talk for every conference. 00:20:28.060 --> 00:20:31.820 the other thing is the list of outline, the list of topics. 00:20:31.820 --> 00:20:35.500 My mistake, the first time I wrote, gave a talk was I did this. 00:20:35.500 --> 00:20:37.880 I went, what are all the things I'd like to talk about? 00:20:37.880 --> 00:20:40.700 And then I crammed them all into the, into one talk. 00:20:40.700 --> 00:20:42.840 this is not what you want to do. 00:20:42.840 --> 00:20:47.780 You want to pick like, you know, one focused thing so that you can go at a reasonably comfortable 00:20:47.780 --> 00:20:48.360 pace. 00:20:48.360 --> 00:20:51.120 You don't want to be talking a hundred miles an hour. 00:20:51.320 --> 00:20:52.500 People can't keep up with you. 00:20:52.500 --> 00:20:54.660 There are some people I'm, I'm good. 00:20:54.660 --> 00:20:55.640 Don't get me wrong. 00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:59.480 There's some people that can talk really fast and pack a lot of information and they're really 00:20:59.480 --> 00:21:00.080 good about it. 00:21:00.080 --> 00:21:04.640 And it's still entertaining, but I think the average person would be better at trying to 00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:05.880 go at a little slower pace. 00:21:05.880 --> 00:21:06.560 So, yeah. 00:21:06.560 --> 00:21:07.000 Yeah. 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:10.960 I totally agree about the, that, and you know, that could be your, like, you could come up 00:21:10.960 --> 00:21:12.500 with that list of all the things you want to talk about. 00:21:12.580 --> 00:21:15.440 And then that could be the source for two or three talks. 00:21:15.440 --> 00:21:15.880 Yeah. 00:21:15.880 --> 00:21:16.320 Yep. 00:21:16.320 --> 00:21:16.480 Right. 00:21:16.480 --> 00:21:19.620 Like, God, this is two, this is kind of like, this all stuff seems to be about fixtures. 00:21:19.620 --> 00:21:23.140 So let's have to do a, like five things that are awesome about fixtures you didn't know. 00:21:23.140 --> 00:21:26.960 And here's like why you should care about structuring your, I don't know, whatever. 00:21:27.220 --> 00:21:32.160 And if they get rejected, but from every conference that you submitted to, you're still one because 00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:33.860 you did all that, that work. 00:21:33.860 --> 00:21:39.320 Just turn it into a, like a blog post or a, or a YouTube video or something. 00:21:39.320 --> 00:21:40.160 Yeah, absolutely. 00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:42.160 A bunch of good feedback from the audience. 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:46.780 John out there says a great place to give a talk is at the user group kind of matched 00:21:46.780 --> 00:21:48.180 exactly the same time I said that. 00:21:48.180 --> 00:21:49.100 So I definitely agree. 00:21:49.100 --> 00:21:49.740 Green there. 00:21:49.740 --> 00:21:52.560 Brandon says, give it a lunch and learn at your company. 00:21:52.560 --> 00:21:53.420 Great idea. 00:21:53.420 --> 00:21:53.820 Yeah. 00:21:53.820 --> 00:21:54.720 That's a really good idea. 00:21:54.720 --> 00:21:56.780 And casual viewer number three. 00:21:57.140 --> 00:22:01.520 does my team as a show and tell, like meeting on Fridays, a show off stuff. 00:22:01.520 --> 00:22:03.460 People can talk about that'd be impactful. 00:22:03.460 --> 00:22:04.440 Also a good place. 00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:04.660 Yeah. 00:22:04.660 --> 00:22:05.320 A lot of good ideas. 00:22:05.320 --> 00:22:08.200 If the venue doesn't exist, you may well be able to create it. 00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:08.420 Yeah. 00:22:08.420 --> 00:22:10.900 And you might get, you might get promoted because of it. 00:22:10.900 --> 00:22:14.320 Cause you're like, Oh, people will know that you're the expert in the company that they 00:22:14.320 --> 00:22:15.080 didn't know before. 00:22:15.080 --> 00:22:15.520 It's good. 00:22:15.520 --> 00:22:16.000 That's right. 00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:16.560 That's right. 00:22:16.560 --> 00:22:16.980 All right. 00:22:16.980 --> 00:22:21.880 I want to come back to something that I know we talked about before, but a feature of it. 00:22:21.880 --> 00:22:27.060 So we talked about Sanic when it came out, there was Sanic and Jopronto and a couple 00:22:27.060 --> 00:22:27.660 other things. 00:22:27.660 --> 00:22:29.860 This, I believe predates FastAPI even. 00:22:29.860 --> 00:22:35.660 And it was one of the very first high, high performance async frameworks for Python. 00:22:35.660 --> 00:22:36.260 Very cool. 00:22:36.260 --> 00:22:40.520 I hadn't really been tracking it that much lately, but if you drop over by the GitHub, 00:22:40.520 --> 00:22:44.160 uh, github.com/Sanic dash org, go to Sanic. 00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:47.200 16,000 stars, 1,500 forks. 00:22:47.200 --> 00:22:48.360 It's going really strong. 00:22:48.580 --> 00:22:50.480 I, I totally did not. 00:22:50.480 --> 00:22:52.120 I've not been tracking it well enough. 00:22:52.120 --> 00:22:54.140 So this is, this is really fantastic. 00:22:54.140 --> 00:22:58.220 So cool way to build asynchronous web apps and Python. 00:22:58.220 --> 00:23:02.180 It's, it claims to be unopinionated and flexible. 00:23:02.180 --> 00:23:07.980 It is the plastic that you build your APIs and your web apps out of as you like, rather than 00:23:07.980 --> 00:23:10.260 being very structured in the way you put stuff together. 00:23:10.260 --> 00:23:14.140 So if you're looking forward to that good, it's, I said, super fast. 00:23:14.380 --> 00:23:19.540 that was its original selling point and apparently used by millions of people, which 00:23:19.540 --> 00:23:20.480 is pretty awesome. 00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:26.360 So what I want to point out here is not Sanic exactly, but rather a new feature that was shared 00:23:26.360 --> 00:23:33.140 with us by Felix and Felix pointed out that, Adam, one of the maintainers just added this 00:23:33.140 --> 00:23:37.640 concept of a worker manager into the new version of Sanic. 00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:43.800 So, if you, if you want to run background work, like I want to send an email or I want to 00:23:43.800 --> 00:23:50.100 send, and do other, like lots of processing or computational work in the background, it's 00:23:50.100 --> 00:23:54.300 going to block up not just a single request, but it's going to block up potentially the 00:23:54.300 --> 00:23:55.400 whole web server, right? 00:23:55.400 --> 00:23:58.800 You get a bunch of things that are querying tons of data or doing a bunch of computation, 00:23:58.800 --> 00:24:03.500 then all of a sudden, or even calling other APIs, potentially that could log up the server, 00:24:03.500 --> 00:24:05.440 especially if it can't be done asynchronously. 00:24:05.440 --> 00:24:11.980 So they added this concept of kind of like a lightweight celery type of thing, where you can push 00:24:11.980 --> 00:24:14.680 the work off to it and have it run in the background and manage that. 00:24:14.680 --> 00:24:15.100 Okay. 00:24:15.100 --> 00:24:18.000 Except for it's just an API inside of Sanic. 00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:22.180 And it starts a sub process that hangs around and does that background work for you. 00:24:22.180 --> 00:24:24.520 So it's like, you don't have to manage another server. 00:24:24.520 --> 00:24:30.000 You don't have to set up celery or Redis and then some worker mechanism to process the messages 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:30.680 coming out of there. 00:24:30.680 --> 00:24:34.120 You just kick the work over to this, worker manager and off it goes. 00:24:34.120 --> 00:24:34.720 Nice. 00:24:34.720 --> 00:24:35.200 Yeah. 00:24:35.200 --> 00:24:35.740 That's pretty cool. 00:24:35.740 --> 00:24:36.180 Pretty cool, huh? 00:24:36.420 --> 00:24:36.660 Yeah. 00:24:36.660 --> 00:24:37.080 Yeah. 00:24:37.080 --> 00:24:43.680 And the way that it works is, basically you can hook into, some lifetime events. 00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:48.760 Like you can use a decorator app dot before server start, and you can go make sure that 00:24:48.760 --> 00:24:51.880 there's a queue that can be used for the communication across that. 00:24:51.880 --> 00:24:53.360 And then you can handle on request. 00:24:53.360 --> 00:24:57.680 And then, when a request comes in, you can like push work over, over to it. 00:24:57.680 --> 00:24:58.000 Yeah. 00:24:58.000 --> 00:25:02.780 Anyway, you can even get it to do like some cool little printout of like the status of what 00:25:02.780 --> 00:25:04.500 the workers are up to and so on. 00:25:04.500 --> 00:25:06.000 So anyway, pretty neat. 00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:10.180 if you need to run asynchronous work and you're looking at a web framework, you know, 00:25:10.180 --> 00:25:11.060 maybe check out Sanic. 00:25:11.060 --> 00:25:15.120 It's got this, this cool feature and it's got a lot of nice async and await features as well. 00:25:15.120 --> 00:25:15.520 Cool. 00:25:15.520 --> 00:25:15.980 Nice. 00:25:15.980 --> 00:25:17.300 All right. 00:25:17.300 --> 00:25:19.780 that's it for our main items, isn't it? 00:25:19.780 --> 00:25:20.820 I guess it is. 00:25:20.820 --> 00:25:21.080 Yeah. 00:25:21.080 --> 00:25:25.240 before we move off this real quick, casual viewer says FastAPI is something similar 00:25:25.240 --> 00:25:26.940 called background task. 00:25:26.940 --> 00:25:27.560 Okay. 00:25:27.560 --> 00:25:28.180 Good to know. 00:25:28.180 --> 00:25:32.200 And yeah, and you can also build those out of your, on your own, using like 00:25:32.200 --> 00:25:33.680 multi-processing or something, but. 00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:34.500 Or any IO. 00:25:34.500 --> 00:25:35.840 Or any IO for sure. 00:25:35.840 --> 00:25:40.360 One of the real challenges of all of those like roll your own things are usually what happens 00:25:40.360 --> 00:25:43.880 is you, you farm out your web server. 00:25:43.880 --> 00:25:48.500 So for example, on Talk Python Training, I think we have eight worker processes that are cruising 00:25:48.500 --> 00:25:49.040 around waiting. 00:25:49.040 --> 00:25:51.680 And like, as far as they're concerned, they are the website. 00:25:51.680 --> 00:25:52.100 Right. 00:25:52.100 --> 00:25:56.320 And if all those things start kicking off background work and they start starting their 00:25:56.320 --> 00:26:00.500 own processes, it'll be like, why are there 17 worker processes cruising around? 00:26:00.500 --> 00:26:01.400 I don't know what's going on. 00:26:01.400 --> 00:26:05.020 So yeah, it's kind of cool to have something that's a little more structured, like that. 00:26:05.020 --> 00:26:05.440 All right. 00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:06.080 extras. 00:26:06.080 --> 00:26:07.260 You said you got some extras. 00:26:07.260 --> 00:26:07.900 Tell us about them. 00:26:07.900 --> 00:26:10.880 well, stuck on the presentation thing. 00:26:10.880 --> 00:26:16.680 but, I ran across this, article called create presentations with, from Jupyter 00:26:16.680 --> 00:26:17.040 notebooks. 00:26:17.520 --> 00:26:19.880 And, I just wanted to link to it. 00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:24.200 If you, if you're thinking about doing a presentation and you want to possibly just use your Jupyter 00:26:24.200 --> 00:26:26.020 notebook, apparently it's built in. 00:26:26.020 --> 00:26:27.780 I didn't know that it was just built in. 00:26:27.780 --> 00:26:33.540 so this just walks through the built-in features of how to, so you gotta, you've got 00:26:33.540 --> 00:26:37.760 a Jupyter notebook, you walk, what you can even do some markdown. 00:26:37.760 --> 00:26:42.240 You can do markdown Jupyter anyway, but there's ways to have both code and markdown together 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:46.220 with this, with IPython display markdown, which is cool. 00:26:46.220 --> 00:26:51.920 and then it, it goes through a couple more examples of things, but then there's this, 00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:52.460 a dropdown. 00:26:52.460 --> 00:26:57.820 You can just say view, view cell toolbar slideshow. 00:26:57.820 --> 00:27:04.460 And then you select, you select slide for each of your, little cells and they become 00:27:04.460 --> 00:27:05.900 slides in your presentation. 00:27:05.900 --> 00:27:13.120 And then you can use, then you can use the built-in NB convert to convert it to, 00:27:13.120 --> 00:27:14.660 uh, presentation. 00:27:14.660 --> 00:27:17.700 So just got an HTML presentation right there. 00:27:17.700 --> 00:27:19.020 So that's pretty neat. 00:27:19.020 --> 00:27:21.500 You can say slide. 00:27:21.500 --> 00:27:23.600 You can say it's a sub slide, a fragment. 00:27:23.600 --> 00:27:27.340 You could skip and you could even make it notes just for like a presentation view. 00:27:27.340 --> 00:27:29.800 That's pretty flexible for per cell in Jupyter. 00:27:29.800 --> 00:27:30.420 That's awesome. 00:27:30.420 --> 00:27:33.080 And then there's ways to either show it by default. 00:27:33.080 --> 00:27:35.980 It shows the code, but you can have a hide the code apparently. 00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:40.260 And then if you want to be able to, to, instead of doing the command line thing, if you want 00:27:40.260 --> 00:27:44.780 to toggle back and forth while you're developing it, they're recommending using the rise 00:27:44.780 --> 00:27:45.180 extension. 00:27:45.520 --> 00:27:46.840 And I tried that. 00:27:46.840 --> 00:27:49.180 I'm like, is this, is it really this easy? 00:27:49.180 --> 00:27:55.620 And so I tried it out and sure enough, it's just, I just went through some of the examples 00:27:55.620 --> 00:27:56.780 and it's really pretty cool. 00:27:56.780 --> 00:28:01.400 And with rise, we've got like these examples and then you can just with rise, you can just 00:28:01.400 --> 00:28:03.880 select this little, this little, icon here. 00:28:03.940 --> 00:28:07.600 It looks like a graph and it just enters into slideshow mode. 00:28:07.600 --> 00:28:08.760 nice. 00:28:08.760 --> 00:28:11.920 Then it, so what happens if you hit space in that mode? 00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:15.020 Does it like automatically take you from one to one? 00:28:15.020 --> 00:28:15.660 Okay, cool. 00:28:15.660 --> 00:28:15.900 Yeah. 00:28:15.900 --> 00:28:16.480 Very nice. 00:28:16.480 --> 00:28:19.400 And you can, you can do the arrows back and forth and stuff. 00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:24.420 You can, so you kind of, it doesn't look as good as the actual presentation at the 00:28:24.420 --> 00:28:28.600 output, but especially if you're trying to like kind of toggle back and forth to see, 00:28:28.600 --> 00:28:31.680 isn't like, is my, is my stuff too big? 00:28:31.680 --> 00:28:36.740 Like right now I w I would totally alter this because it, it, it looks too, it doesn't look 00:28:36.740 --> 00:28:37.260 good right now. 00:28:37.260 --> 00:28:42.940 but that's kind of what you do with slideshows is you sort of work, work with them until they 00:28:42.940 --> 00:28:43.360 look good. 00:28:43.360 --> 00:28:46.720 But anyway, so this is, something I wanted to share. 00:28:46.720 --> 00:28:51.280 It was just this, if you want to try using Jupyter for your presentation, here's a link 00:28:51.280 --> 00:28:53.700 kind of maybe take a look at this article. 00:28:53.700 --> 00:29:01.660 the other thing I wanted to point out as an extra is, what Python py test as 00:29:01.660 --> 00:29:04.200 7.2 py test 7.2 released. 00:29:04.200 --> 00:29:10.120 I don't normally like, I mean, I love, I'm personally, if I'm like ready to try every 00:29:10.120 --> 00:29:14.920 new release that comes out, but why I'm bringing this up, is there's a couple of things that 00:29:14.920 --> 00:29:16.200 bit us at work. 00:29:16.200 --> 00:29:22.220 And I want to, if they might bite you, the PI library is now separated from py test. 00:29:22.220 --> 00:29:27.340 So you don't get the PI library by default when you import, when you, you're installing 00:29:27.340 --> 00:29:27.920 py test. 00:29:27.920 --> 00:29:32.540 So if you are using the PI library, you just have to make that one of your own requirements. 00:29:32.540 --> 00:29:35.420 You were cheating and not stating it as a requirement. 00:29:35.420 --> 00:29:36.800 Cause I'd always be there. 00:29:36.800 --> 00:29:37.180 We know. 00:29:37.180 --> 00:29:41.040 I don't think we were, I don't think we were using it at all, but I think we may have 00:29:41.040 --> 00:29:44.040 declared like, like py path or something like that. 00:29:44.040 --> 00:29:44.320 Yeah. 00:29:44.320 --> 00:29:44.780 Whatever. 00:29:44.780 --> 00:29:48.860 a couple more things, that I think is neat. 00:29:48.980 --> 00:29:55.640 a few releases ago, I added, the test paths, so that you can add a import path, 00:29:55.640 --> 00:29:59.080 uh, to your, for where, like where your source code is. 00:29:59.080 --> 00:30:03.820 And, for this release, they added a shell style wildcard support. 00:30:03.820 --> 00:30:04.840 So that's pretty cool. 00:30:04.840 --> 00:30:07.780 and there's a whole bunch of cool features. 00:30:07.780 --> 00:30:11.360 So, yeah, check out py tests if you're up for it. 00:30:11.360 --> 00:30:14.820 Oh, one of the things, I'm really glad they deprecated nose. 00:30:14.820 --> 00:30:15.440 I can't remember. 00:30:15.440 --> 00:30:18.840 Can't remember where it's listed here, but they're, they're not using. 00:30:18.840 --> 00:30:21.460 So set up this, just the keywords, set up and tear down. 00:30:21.460 --> 00:30:22.700 You could define functions. 00:30:22.700 --> 00:30:26.620 You were able to define functions, set up and tear down, and those were run automatically, 00:30:26.620 --> 00:30:30.880 but those were run automatically because they were part of the nose support. 00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:35.500 So even if you don't know what nose is, if you're using those, those are deprecated. 00:30:35.500 --> 00:30:36.820 So stop using those. 00:30:36.820 --> 00:30:41.160 there's other ways to, to do set up and tear down with py test. 00:30:41.160 --> 00:30:43.300 And so check that out if you're using that. 00:30:43.300 --> 00:30:47.620 And I'm, and then the first edition of the py test book, I actually talked about set up and 00:30:47.620 --> 00:30:51.000 tear down and luckily in the second edition, I took those out. 00:30:51.000 --> 00:30:52.360 So yeah. 00:30:52.360 --> 00:30:52.840 Very good. 00:30:52.840 --> 00:30:53.260 You saw that. 00:30:53.260 --> 00:30:53.600 Awesome. 00:30:53.600 --> 00:30:55.180 Awesome. 00:30:55.180 --> 00:30:55.740 Cool. 00:30:55.740 --> 00:30:59.320 bit of followup on your Jupyter item here. 00:30:59.320 --> 00:31:03.600 Henry Schreiner says, you can also use this in labs in JupyterLab, not the old notebook. 00:31:03.600 --> 00:31:08.520 So if you want to use rise live editable presentations, that still requires the old notebook. 00:31:08.520 --> 00:31:08.900 Same. 00:31:08.900 --> 00:31:09.240 Okay. 00:31:09.240 --> 00:31:09.720 Okay. 00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:12.120 So you can do use JupyterLab for presentations too. 00:31:12.120 --> 00:31:12.660 Awesome. 00:31:12.940 --> 00:31:13.080 Yeah. 00:31:13.080 --> 00:31:13.620 Yeah. 00:31:13.620 --> 00:31:13.940 Very cool. 00:31:13.940 --> 00:31:20.940 And then also Brandon points out that background task from when we credited FastAPI may actually 00:31:20.940 --> 00:31:21.800 come from starlet. 00:31:21.800 --> 00:31:24.760 For those of you don't know, FastAPI is a layer on top of starlet. 00:31:24.760 --> 00:31:29.140 So a lot of times what people perceive as a FastAPI feature is actually a starlet feature. 00:31:29.320 --> 00:31:36.540 And, it also, Henry says that also now the notebooks now warn you, if you return 00:31:36.540 --> 00:31:41.660 from a test on, sorry, now also warns you for a term from a pitest function, this would 00:31:41.660 --> 00:31:43.080 be an error in pitest eight. 00:31:43.080 --> 00:31:43.460 Okay. 00:31:43.460 --> 00:31:44.020 Yeah. 00:31:44.280 --> 00:31:48.600 Well, yeah, apparently some people were like returning true or false from their test functions 00:31:48.600 --> 00:31:52.780 and, and wanting that to like indicate whether a test passed or failed. 00:31:52.780 --> 00:31:53.700 Don't do that. 00:31:53.700 --> 00:31:55.540 Didn't you just parse the print statements? 00:31:55.540 --> 00:31:58.340 No, it's an exception. 00:31:58.340 --> 00:32:00.560 If an exception happens, that's a failure. 00:32:00.560 --> 00:32:01.920 So of course. 00:32:01.920 --> 00:32:02.320 All right. 00:32:02.320 --> 00:32:05.020 I got a few extras and we'll, we'll bust out some jokes. 00:32:05.020 --> 00:32:05.480 These are quick. 00:32:05.480 --> 00:32:11.580 Rich, the colorizing formatting, awesome TUI foundation is great. 00:32:11.580 --> 00:32:13.560 Now available on PyScript. 00:32:13.560 --> 00:32:19.680 So rich, yeah, you just, you just do rich things and just, you know, print this stuff 00:32:19.680 --> 00:32:20.060 all out. 00:32:20.060 --> 00:32:20.720 And guess what? 00:32:20.720 --> 00:32:25.100 It now comes out as like colorized output and HTML, I guess. 00:32:25.100 --> 00:32:29.780 I'm not sure, where the destination is going to land, but, it says rebel. 00:32:29.780 --> 00:32:32.720 So I'm guessing, maybe, prints out in the rebel there. 00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:35.460 Anyway, there's a bunch of notes on how to use rich in PyScript. 00:32:35.540 --> 00:32:38.960 So if you like PyScript and you're tracking that project and you like rich, put them together. 00:32:38.960 --> 00:32:43.280 Also, we talked about, YouTube videos and you could get a, make a talk. 00:32:43.280 --> 00:32:44.120 You could just make it a video. 00:32:44.120 --> 00:32:50.720 So I did a Python 311 in 100 seconds video that I released, yesterday, the day before. 00:32:50.720 --> 00:32:51.900 I think it was yesterday actually. 00:32:51.900 --> 00:32:52.360 Yeah. 00:32:52.360 --> 00:32:55.340 Anyway, people can check that out if they've got a hundred seconds to spare and they want 00:32:55.340 --> 00:32:58.600 to know what's cool about Python 311 and why it's neat. 00:32:58.600 --> 00:32:59.700 that's fun. 00:32:59.700 --> 00:33:01.120 links in the show notes there. 00:33:01.120 --> 00:33:01.800 All right. 00:33:01.800 --> 00:33:02.580 Ready for some jokes? 00:33:02.580 --> 00:33:03.260 Yes. 00:33:03.260 --> 00:33:03.740 Okay. 00:33:03.980 --> 00:33:08.700 So here's one, it's titled laughter in Linux, but it's about windows. 00:33:08.700 --> 00:33:12.760 So you might have to go back a ways for people to get this joke, but let's see. 00:33:12.760 --> 00:33:14.640 I know you spent some time in windows, Brian. 00:33:14.640 --> 00:33:15.580 Let me see what you think about this. 00:33:15.800 --> 00:33:20.420 So here's like, sort of a karate master type of scenario. 00:33:20.420 --> 00:33:26.020 And like the sensei says, it's time for you to look inward and start asking yourself the 00:33:26.020 --> 00:33:26.600 big question. 00:33:26.600 --> 00:33:28.220 What happened to the A and B drive? 00:33:28.220 --> 00:33:29.360 Hmm. 00:33:29.620 --> 00:33:31.000 Because it's all you see, right? 00:33:31.000 --> 00:33:32.020 It's all you see. 00:33:32.020 --> 00:33:34.200 It used to make that noise. 00:33:34.200 --> 00:33:36.480 Pretty much. 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:38.000 If it's not a C drive, it makes noise. 00:33:38.000 --> 00:33:39.740 It's my understanding from my history. 00:33:39.740 --> 00:33:42.580 It, some of them make that, sort of a disky noise. 00:33:42.580 --> 00:33:46.520 Are there like a CD seeking noise, but there's always a noise associated with a non C drive. 00:33:46.520 --> 00:33:48.220 I know that's not always true, but it's fun. 00:33:49.340 --> 00:33:49.740 All right. 00:33:49.740 --> 00:33:50.240 Other one. 00:33:50.240 --> 00:33:55.880 This one is not about OSs and discs, but rather databases and it's dating advice. 00:33:55.880 --> 00:34:00.900 So here's a woman talking to a clearly nerdy programmer type. 00:34:00.900 --> 00:34:04.420 And it says, what do you need for a good relationship? 00:34:04.420 --> 00:34:05.600 The guy looks at her. 00:34:05.600 --> 00:34:06.920 Obviously primary keys. 00:34:06.920 --> 00:34:07.900 Primary keys. 00:34:07.900 --> 00:34:11.120 Yeah. 00:34:11.120 --> 00:34:12.060 So bad. 00:34:12.060 --> 00:34:13.620 Anyway, that's what I got. 00:34:13.620 --> 00:34:15.060 Dude from the IT crowd. 00:34:15.060 --> 00:34:15.620 Okay. 00:34:15.620 --> 00:34:15.960 Yeah. 00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:16.340 Yeah. 00:34:16.340 --> 00:34:18.520 I need to watch more TV to fully catch the means. 00:34:18.520 --> 00:34:18.940 Don't I? 00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:20.700 So, yeah. 00:34:20.700 --> 00:34:21.180 Cool. 00:34:21.180 --> 00:34:21.700 All right. 00:34:21.700 --> 00:34:23.620 Well, always fun to have you here. 00:34:23.620 --> 00:34:25.120 Definitely. 00:34:25.120 --> 00:34:25.840 Thanks. 00:34:25.840 --> 00:34:28.260 And thanks everybody for showing up an hour early. 00:34:28.260 --> 00:34:29.300 I really appreciate it. 00:34:29.300 --> 00:34:29.860 Yeah, absolutely. 00:34:29.860 --> 00:34:32.680 Try to be the, we'll try to stick to that time for a while. 00:34:32.680 --> 00:34:35.380 And I guess we'll let you know if we don't. 00:34:35.380 --> 00:34:35.900 All right. 00:34:35.900 --> 00:34:36.500 See y'all later.