WEBVTT 00:00:00.020 --> 00:00:04.680 Hello and welcome to Python Bytes, where we deliver Python news and headlines directly to your earbuds. 00:00:05.260 --> 00:00:09.200 This is episode 431, recorded May 5th, 2025. 00:00:10.100 --> 00:00:11.120 And I am Brian Okken. 00:00:11.280 --> 00:00:12.040 And I am Michael Kennedy. 00:00:12.500 --> 00:00:15.200 And this episode is sponsored by NordLayer. 00:00:15.480 --> 00:00:17.300 Listen to their spot later in the show. 00:00:17.640 --> 00:00:31.640 And if you'd like to connect with us, you can, or suggest topics, please feel free to send us an email or head on over to either Mastodon or BlueSky and the links to both of us and the show are in the show notes. 00:00:32.180 --> 00:00:39.040 And you can join this episode live or join it live usually Mondays at 10, but sometimes other times. 00:00:39.520 --> 00:00:45.040 But head on over to pythonbytes.fm/live to sign up and see the schedule for the next one. 00:00:45.400 --> 00:00:49.720 But also you can, that's on YouTube, so you can watch them later if you'd like. 00:00:50.060 --> 00:00:53.080 And I'd also like to encourage people to sign up for the newsletter. 00:00:53.500 --> 00:00:57.280 We send out a weekly email with all the links from the show. 00:00:57.360 --> 00:00:58.460 plus background information. 00:00:58.780 --> 00:00:59.520 It's a lot of fun. 00:00:59.780 --> 00:01:00.560 So check that out. 00:01:00.840 --> 00:01:04.540 Also, I think it'd be cool to have a cool first topic, Michael. 00:01:04.960 --> 00:01:05.260 What you got? 00:01:06.260 --> 00:01:11.040 This was a nice, easy one, easy to adopt, easy to appreciate, I think. 00:01:11.360 --> 00:01:20.040 So you and I, we spend a lot of time talking about, here's the new things for this, and here's the new thing for Python, and here's the new features, the next version, and test the alpha, test the beta. 00:01:20.560 --> 00:01:24.460 And we also talk about when they go out of support, but I don't know how you feel. 00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:26.980 I often, that sneaks up on me. 00:01:27.280 --> 00:01:29.760 I mean, the fact that 3.8 is out of support seems wrong. 00:01:30.360 --> 00:01:31.600 But it is, you know what I mean? 00:01:32.040 --> 00:01:32.120 Yeah. 00:01:32.400 --> 00:01:35.840 And so you might be sitting at your terminal just going, what's that status again? 00:01:36.260 --> 00:01:40.440 And so I present to you Pyrel, P-I-R-E-L. 00:01:41.000 --> 00:01:45.220 And what it is, is it's the release cycle of Python at your fingertips. 00:01:45.800 --> 00:01:45.980 Ooh, 00:01:46.400 --> 00:01:46.460 cool. 00:01:46.460 --> 00:01:46.740 Yeah, so 00:01:46.740 --> 00:01:49.080 there's a little graphic here, I suppose. 00:01:49.920 --> 00:01:51.940 I could open up the image full size, perhaps. 00:01:52.600 --> 00:01:56.380 And you just type whatever, doesn't matter how you have Python active. 00:01:56.460 --> 00:02:06.540 if it's the system one or if it's a virtual environment one, you can write Pyrelle check and it'll give you a nice summary of what's going on here. 00:02:06.560 --> 00:02:13.280 You can say you're using Python 3.13, which is actively maintained, and it will be this good for this long. 00:02:13.620 --> 00:02:22.580 You can say Pyrelle list and it'll give you a list of all of the last 10 or so versions when they came and when they went. 00:02:23.100 --> 00:02:24.600 So it's pretty cool. 00:02:24.780 --> 00:02:30.960 I mean, that's more or less what it does, but it tells you that you can get, you know, go get a new Python version if yours is getting older. 00:02:31.200 --> 00:02:34.060 And the status as well, is it still getting feature updates? 00:02:34.640 --> 00:02:35.740 Is it in bug fix level? 00:02:36.060 --> 00:02:38.320 Is it security fixes or is it YOLO? 00:02:38.780 --> 00:02:39.720 I just can't be bothered. 00:02:41.480 --> 00:02:42.880 Anyway, that's what this is. 00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:43.520 What do you think? 00:02:43.800 --> 00:02:44.840 I think that's pretty fun. 00:02:45.220 --> 00:02:45.300 Yeah. 00:02:45.560 --> 00:02:46.020 Also, 00:02:46.440 --> 00:02:46.520 yeah. 00:02:46.760 --> 00:02:47.120 Yeah. 00:02:47.320 --> 00:02:51.360 And it uses the rocket emoji, which will make a reappearance, right? 00:02:51.760 --> 00:02:51.840 Yeah. 00:02:52.300 --> 00:02:53.240 I do like the rocket emoji. 00:02:54.080 --> 00:02:54.280 Indeed. 00:02:54.660 --> 00:03:02.040 So there's a little bit else you can do with it, though it does not particularly interest me as a tool, nonetheless. 00:03:03.260 --> 00:03:12.420 You can also type Pyroguess, and it will do things like give you various trivia about the release history of Python. 00:03:12.880 --> 00:03:15.660 So, for example, it might ask, when was Python 3.11 released? 00:03:15.770 --> 00:03:17.640 Or who is the release manager for 3.6? 00:03:18.240 --> 00:03:22.160 And it gives you a multi-choice select, and you can pick, and it'll tell you if you're right or wrong. 00:03:22.200 --> 00:03:27.460 So if you like Python release history and seeing the details, you can do that. 00:03:27.780 --> 00:03:30.540 But I think the payroll list and the payroll check is pretty cool. 00:03:31.160 --> 00:03:32.140 Yeah, I like it. 00:03:32.480 --> 00:03:32.660 Neat. 00:03:32.960 --> 00:03:33.620 Yeah, that's it. 00:03:33.900 --> 00:03:34.120 All right. 00:03:34.520 --> 00:03:38.700 Well, I want to cover something that we've covered before, kind of. 00:03:39.180 --> 00:03:40.720 Back to the future. 00:03:41.140 --> 00:03:43.100 Back to, we're going to go back in time. 00:03:43.640 --> 00:03:46.740 This is episode 123, which, when was that? 00:03:46.820 --> 00:03:50.020 That was like in May 26, 2019. 00:03:50.330 --> 00:03:53.060 We recorded it and it came out on the 29th. 00:03:53.540 --> 00:03:53.780 Right. 00:03:53.780 --> 00:03:54.640 And we had no idea. 00:03:55.070 --> 00:03:56.840 Things were different back then, 2019. 00:03:57.320 --> 00:03:58.720 2019, different world. 00:03:59.520 --> 00:04:09.560 But one of the things that started in that was when we announced, well, we didn't announce it, but we covered it on the show way back in 2019. 00:04:09.870 --> 00:04:12.060 The introduction of FastAPI. 00:04:12.110 --> 00:04:13.340 So we talked about it. 00:04:13.480 --> 00:04:15.840 This new cool web framework called FastAPI. 00:04:16.200 --> 00:04:23.680 Well, FastAPI has been growing and it's now the number one web framework, not just across Python, but across everything. 00:04:24.120 --> 00:04:28.900 So it's been an incredible thing to watch and some great work out there. 00:04:29.420 --> 00:05:30.360 Well, today, Sebastian Ramirez, the dude that created FastAPI in the first place, he announced that he is forming FastAPI Labs, a new company, and that they are, the FastAPI Labs is a new company and they're building a fast api cloud so we're going to take a look what does this mean it kind of means that you just get to build your fast if you do this the promise is you build a fast api application and you can just deploy it with um fast api deploy just a single line and and then they'll they'll host it on their um like a subdomain of the fast api cloud.dev so um kind of interesting. I'm intrigued. So I've definitely joined the wait list. There is an announcement blog post of by the same team behind FastAPI. So this is, this is kind of an incredible, he's built FastAPI up and it's not just, not just Sebastian. Now there's other people working on it. 00:05:30.550 --> 00:05:43.020 It's built on top of Pydantic and a couple of cool things that I can't remember. But, But the team is, the blog post talks about the problems of deploying to the cloud. 00:05:43.060 --> 00:05:46.200 Now, there is documentation on the FastAPI. 00:05:47.360 --> 00:05:51.400 We've often commented that the FastAPI documentation is excellent. 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:53.280 They've done a great job with documentation. 00:05:53.880 --> 00:06:00.680 But it is not trivial to really deploy anything anymore, aside from maybe a static site. 00:06:01.080 --> 00:06:07.240 But you have to get concerned with a lot of stuff, especially if you start growing with security. 00:06:07.430 --> 00:06:10.020 And so they are looking at that security bit. 00:06:11.620 --> 00:06:23.700 So it's so far, it looks like Patrick Armino, Alejandro Sanchez, Sophie Van Langen, sorry, and Sebastian. 00:06:25.240 --> 00:06:26.780 And probably more. 00:06:27.290 --> 00:06:30.060 I'm not sure if that's part of the team or if that's just anyway. 00:06:30.560 --> 00:06:36.600 They might be, I don't know how many people are in the company right now, but he's promising to keep FastAPI open source. 00:06:37.160 --> 00:06:44.120 And to also, interesting in this is that he doesn't want to have vendor lock-in. 00:06:44.340 --> 00:06:52.740 So whatever processes they build up, it won't make it so that you're stuck with FastAPI with their hosting. 00:06:53.220 --> 00:06:55.180 So essentially this is hosting for FastAPI. 00:06:55.380 --> 00:06:56.200 So kind of neat. 00:06:56.440 --> 00:06:56.540 Yeah, 00:06:56.740 --> 00:06:59.300 congratulations, Sebastian and crew. 00:06:59.440 --> 00:06:59.740 That's awesome. 00:07:00.140 --> 00:07:00.280 Yeah. 00:07:00.360 --> 00:07:01.040 It 00:07:01.040 --> 00:07:02.480 is a hassle to deploy things. 00:07:02.660 --> 00:07:06.960 And presumably these folks know the best way to host FastAPI. 00:07:07.240 --> 00:07:11.600 FastAPI might be tuned for the infrastructure that they choose over time. 00:07:12.080 --> 00:07:13.760 You know, I'll have to look more into this. 00:07:13.980 --> 00:07:16.160 Like how do you host a database and things like that. 00:07:16.340 --> 00:07:26.800 But presumably you can do things like use a CNAME for your app at fastapicloud.com and you'll get your own domain name and all that sort of stuff. 00:07:26.980 --> 00:07:27.700 But very interesting. 00:07:28.100 --> 00:07:28.920 Yeah, it is. 00:07:29.080 --> 00:07:34.860 Also, like for, interestingly, that was the first thing I thought is like, well, I probably don't want to use their domain. 00:07:35.340 --> 00:07:40.440 But for, you know, for an API endpoint for some internal tools and stuff, I might not care. 00:07:42.540 --> 00:07:43.780 So I think some people. 00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:44.300 That's a good point. 00:07:44.719 --> 00:07:45.560 You would care a 00:07:45.560 --> 00:07:46.580 whole lot less, right? 00:07:46.660 --> 00:07:47.680 If it's just an API 00:07:47.680 --> 00:07:48.720 and it's not 00:07:48.720 --> 00:07:51.140 like your landing page or whatever. 00:07:51.680 --> 00:07:51.860 Yeah. 00:07:52.170 --> 00:07:52.300 Yeah. 00:07:52.880 --> 00:07:53.060 Anyway. 00:07:53.240 --> 00:07:53.380 Cool. 00:07:53.700 --> 00:07:53.960 Cool stuff. 00:07:54.659 --> 00:07:55.020 Absolutely. 00:07:55.580 --> 00:07:56.840 Well, what else is cool, Brian? 00:07:57.600 --> 00:07:57.700 What? 00:07:57.780 --> 00:08:43.960 NordLayer. 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Try NordLayer risk-free with their 14-day money-back guarantee. 00:09:44.360 --> 00:09:47.500 Visit pythonbytes.fm/nordlayer to get started. 00:09:48.020 --> 00:09:49.400 Link is in your podcast player show notes. 00:09:49.780 --> 00:09:51.700 Thank you to Nordlayer for supporting the show. 00:09:51.980 --> 00:09:52.300 All right. 00:09:52.920 --> 00:09:57.600 Next, we, you know, going back in time, a little less in time. 00:09:58.440 --> 00:10:01.500 This is just a couple episodes ago in episode 428. 00:10:02.420 --> 00:10:04.240 We covered t-strings. 00:10:04.560 --> 00:10:08.580 So t-strings are going to come in 3.14 in the Py release. 00:10:09.340 --> 00:10:14.080 So there is one of the authors, Dave Beck, or Dave Peck, sorry, Dave. 00:10:14.500 --> 00:10:18.420 wrote an article about the Python's new t-strings. 00:10:18.480 --> 00:10:24.820 And I'm kind of excited about it because when we talked about it on the show, I'm excited about them, but I also, they're like template strings. 00:10:25.060 --> 00:10:27.220 But how are they different than f-strings? 00:10:28.180 --> 00:10:29.600 When would I use one over the other? 00:10:30.060 --> 00:10:34.640 And I got all these answers in this blog post. 00:10:35.040 --> 00:10:39.240 So he talks about what's the big idea of t-strings. 00:10:39.720 --> 00:10:45.600 And interestingly enough, We've loved f-strings so much that they're used inappropriately. 00:10:46.200 --> 00:10:48.780 And I didn't really realize that there's security problems. 00:10:49.460 --> 00:11:00.300 So there's like comments on using f-strings to take user data, user input, and fill in like maybe a SQL statement. 00:11:00.980 --> 00:11:01.800 Don't do that. 00:11:02.800 --> 00:11:05.260 You want to clean your user input first. 00:11:06.200 --> 00:11:11.880 So people have been using it and or possibly to use it to generate a web page. 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:24.360 So you've got a possibility of somebody inserting cross-site scripting or other bad things that you don't expect by just sticking user data into HTML. 00:11:24.970 --> 00:11:29.520 So misusing f-strings is one of the reasons why t-strings are kind of a cool thing. 00:11:29.920 --> 00:11:35.340 So the template strings are a generalization of f-strings, and they keep things separate. 00:11:35.520 --> 00:11:46.120 So f strings actually create a string, but t strings don't create, when you create a t string, you don't get a t string, you get a, or a string, you get a template object. 00:11:46.580 --> 00:11:49.420 And this template object has these two separate things. 00:11:49.520 --> 00:11:57.220 You've got, it's got a, I'm going to scroll down, it's got a strings section and a values. 00:11:57.580 --> 00:12:03.740 And so it keeps, they're both tuples of things, of what's inside of it. 00:12:04.080 --> 00:12:05.280 And you can iterate through them. 00:12:05.460 --> 00:12:08.920 There's all sorts of cool stuff you can do with templates, these template strings. 00:12:09.620 --> 00:12:14.940 But this is a nice, really good walkthrough of kind of what's inside and why they're different than f-strings. 00:12:15.000 --> 00:12:16.000 They're very different now. 00:12:16.620 --> 00:12:22.800 And but talking about there's inside, there's a what's the value? 00:12:23.100 --> 00:12:26.680 There's a interpolations are a thing that's in there. 00:12:26.700 --> 00:12:29.720 So you might have it might be a string. 00:12:29.760 --> 00:12:30.300 It might be other. 00:12:30.540 --> 00:12:31.400 It might be something else. 00:12:32.600 --> 00:12:35.180 And the interpolations have all the pieces in place. 00:12:35.810 --> 00:12:50.440 And you can even dive really deep into it and have things like what's the value of the variable that you passed in, the expression name, the conversion, the format specifier, even if you've got format specifiers on it. 00:12:51.420 --> 00:12:54.000 And this is all sorts of nitty gritty detail. 00:12:54.150 --> 00:12:58.360 But the gist I'm taking away is they're just really kept separate. 00:12:58.560 --> 00:13:03.880 So you've got like the template and the things you're passing into the template as completely separate things. 00:13:04.460 --> 00:13:05.120 Why is that great? 00:13:05.360 --> 00:13:17.660 Well, one of the great things about that is you can, like in the example of SQL or HTML, you can take the user data and check all of that and run things over it. 00:13:17.760 --> 00:13:24.640 So if you've got user data and you expected a string, you expected people to not be nefarious about it. 00:13:24.960 --> 00:13:38.840 You can do like a safe HTML or something, convert like the brackets into something else, strip out SQL statements so that they're not, it's not a, you know, escape things, escaping things and making them cleaner. 00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:41.560 One fun example in this, I love this. 00:13:42.080 --> 00:13:47.460 A fun example is how to create PigLatin using template strings. 00:13:48.660 --> 00:13:52.740 And so there's like this PigLatin converter that takes a template and returns a string. 00:13:53.020 --> 00:14:03.900 So you're able to have like a hello world and then you run PigLatin on the template and it converts the template into, we've got these converter functions. 00:14:04.310 --> 00:14:06.600 You can convert into actual string. 00:14:07.220 --> 00:14:18.240 And I kind of, okay, I went down a rabbit hole on this because this example says to convert, I kind of forgot the rules of PigLatin because it's been a while since I've been a kid. 00:14:18.800 --> 00:14:30.280 But it says essentially if the first character is a vowel, if the words in the word, the first character is a vowel, then you append yay on the end. 00:14:30.500 --> 00:14:38.260 But if it's not a vowel, you take the rest of the word and take the first character and put it at the end and say a. 00:14:38.620 --> 00:14:40.000 And I don't think that's correct. 00:14:40.140 --> 00:14:42.920 Or I think it might be correct, but I forgot the rules. 00:14:43.420 --> 00:14:44.360 So I looked it up. 00:14:45.639 --> 00:14:53.000 And Pig Latin, sorry about this, but Pig Latin, it says that it's not just the first constant, but it's the first constant cluster. 00:14:53.240 --> 00:14:55.160 So I don't think this is the correct implementation. 00:14:57.399 --> 00:14:57.800 Well, 00:14:57.800 --> 00:14:59.620 it might be one that fits on one screen. 00:15:00.140 --> 00:15:00.380 Yeah. 00:15:01.020 --> 00:15:06.300 So Brian would translate into Ian Bray, not Ryan Bay. 00:15:07.380 --> 00:15:08.020 You know, anyway. 00:15:08.680 --> 00:15:08.840 Okay. 00:15:09.160 --> 00:15:09.620 The diversion. 00:15:10.060 --> 00:15:10.420 But anyway. 00:15:11.100 --> 00:15:24.760 So there's some great ideas for when we finally have t-strings and we ship Python 3.14, we can do things like possibly having everything more safer and more flexible. 00:15:25.340 --> 00:15:29.060 One of the things that's coming up possibly is, oh, where'd it go? 00:15:30.540 --> 00:15:30.900 787. 00:15:31.290 --> 00:15:38.960 So there's a proposal for safer subprocess usage with like Schlex and Subpros, which I love Schlex. 00:15:39.580 --> 00:15:45.400 But you could use a, if those could be implemented with t-strings, they'd be a lot safer. 00:15:45.590 --> 00:15:48.720 So there are some security vulnerabilities in these things. 00:15:49.000 --> 00:15:51.040 So it could simplify the implementation. 00:15:51.040 --> 00:15:55.560 You don't want to ampersand, ampersand, do other thing as part of your command, right? 00:15:55.840 --> 00:15:56.120 Yeah. 00:15:56.420 --> 00:16:14.640 So this, and then, so having a lot of things that to take user input and create other things, Having them use t-strings might, and having like some quick, safe conversions, instead of having to convert user data ahead of time, you just grab the user data and stick it in a template string. 00:16:15.040 --> 00:16:18.240 And then later in your pipeline, clean up the user data. 00:16:18.580 --> 00:16:19.460 Those are pretty cool things. 00:16:20.000 --> 00:16:22.500 So there's also some attribute things. 00:16:23.140 --> 00:16:31.280 There's other ways you can, since they're separate, all the way until you do the conversion, you can do like some cool attribute things that he covers in the article too. 00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:32.160 So anyway. 00:16:32.400 --> 00:16:33.520 Yeah, looks like a great article. 00:16:33.920 --> 00:16:34.260 Thanks, Dave. 00:16:34.680 --> 00:16:34.800 Ryan. 00:16:35.240 --> 00:16:41.960 I'm going to have Paul Everett on Talk Python, not this week, next week, to talk about t-strings. 00:16:42.400 --> 00:16:43.160 Oh, perfect. 00:16:43.380 --> 00:16:43.440 Yeah. 00:16:43.680 --> 00:16:44.840 We're going to be diving into it some more. 00:16:44.920 --> 00:16:45.420 Yeah, it should be fun. 00:16:45.680 --> 00:16:45.900 Nice. 00:16:46.940 --> 00:16:47.160 Indeed. 00:16:47.760 --> 00:16:48.800 Let's go back to the terminal. 00:16:49.580 --> 00:16:56.660 And this one, I think, is also pretty interesting, especially if you're learning the terminal or you're just like, how do I do that again? 00:16:57.240 --> 00:16:57.520 Zev. 00:16:57.660 --> 00:16:58.500 Have you heard of Zev? 00:16:58.880 --> 00:16:59.120 No. 00:16:59.460 --> 00:17:03.140 It's a simple CLI tool that helps you remember terminal commands. 00:17:03.660 --> 00:17:08.900 So if you're sitting here and you're like, you know, I don't really know what I'm doing with this stuff. 00:17:09.230 --> 00:17:11.079 I can type Zev and it says, what do you want to do? 00:17:11.140 --> 00:17:15.040 It says, show all files in this directory with human readable sizes. 00:17:15.579 --> 00:17:16.740 And it says, okay, great. 00:17:16.959 --> 00:17:18.199 Here are a couple of things you could do. 00:17:18.470 --> 00:17:24.760 And it gives you a select list like ls-lh or I think it was find is one of the options. 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:28.500 But basically it gives you a bunch of options to do those types of things. 00:17:28.920 --> 00:17:29.680 And up it goes. 00:17:30.010 --> 00:17:30.480 Pretty cool, right? 00:17:30.880 --> 00:17:31.040 Yeah. 00:17:31.720 --> 00:17:31.920 Yeah. 00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:40.800 So this project runs on top of LLM APIs like OpenAI, Google Gemini, or local Olama. 00:17:41.240 --> 00:17:45.020 So basically it sends that command over and then it looks at all the responses. 00:17:45.460 --> 00:17:47.520 But it probably does a bunch of work to format 00:17:47.520 --> 00:17:47.940 it for 00:17:47.940 --> 00:17:48.060 you. 00:17:48.140 --> 00:17:53.320 But more importantly, it puts it right there in your terminal where you can just select the answer and hit enter. 00:17:53.400 --> 00:17:57.800 You don't have to go to chat, copy it, move it back over, run it. 00:17:57.960 --> 00:17:59.480 You know, like that sort of round tripping. 00:17:59.820 --> 00:18:00.040 Yeah. 00:18:00.520 --> 00:18:00.640 Okay. 00:18:01.360 --> 00:18:15.240 Yeah, so suggestions that you might use are like show all running Python processes, find all Python files modified in the last 24 hours, show disk usage for the current directory, check if google.com is reachable, etc, etc. 00:18:15.620 --> 00:18:17.120 So yeah, pretty neat. 00:18:17.240 --> 00:18:21.360 It does say everything's generated by LLMs, so careful. 00:18:23.460 --> 00:18:25.880 Because you know how it goes, right? 00:18:25.900 --> 00:18:31.420 It could be delete all files like this in this directory, and in this directory part gets forgotten. 00:18:32.700 --> 00:18:34.780 rm-rf star, okay. 00:18:36.620 --> 00:18:38.620 Slash star, slash star. 00:18:39.160 --> 00:18:39.560 Anyway, super 00:18:39.560 --> 00:18:41.340 simple, but you set up an LLM provider. 00:18:41.580 --> 00:18:52.100 I recently wrote a really cool program that I'm, program, utility, simple tool, that I use that I'm thinking of making public somehow, but I also don't need another thing to babysit. 00:18:52.360 --> 00:19:04.400 But basically, if you're in a Git repository, you can just hit a command and it will look at all the new files, the change files, and then correlate that with a local LLM, coding-based LLM. 00:19:04.410 --> 00:19:12.960 It says, create me a Git summary of everything, like the header, and then actually a detailed summary, and what happened if you forgot all the things you did. 00:19:13.100 --> 00:19:14.920 A little bit like this, but that's not out yet. 00:19:15.140 --> 00:19:15.600 But this is cool. 00:19:15.600 --> 00:19:15.700 I 00:19:15.700 --> 00:19:16.280 like to see this. 00:19:16.500 --> 00:19:19.360 Like, what did I do on Friday to run on Monday? 00:19:19.640 --> 00:19:20.060 Yeah, exactly. 00:19:20.400 --> 00:19:20.880 You could totally 00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:21.200 do it. 00:19:21.680 --> 00:19:23.120 And it improves it in this way. 00:19:23.180 --> 00:19:24.820 You're like, oh, gosh, I did improve it in that way. 00:19:25.000 --> 00:19:25.480 Look at this show. 00:19:25.600 --> 00:19:26.240 Aren't I smart? 00:19:29.200 --> 00:19:39.300 And before we carry on looping back to your topic, the t-strings, Henry Schreiner writes, I've been wondering if this could be supported in the logging module. 00:19:39.680 --> 00:19:41.640 Since it's an actual type, it could be detected. 00:19:41.980 --> 00:19:42.140 Yeah. 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:42.420 That 00:19:42.420 --> 00:19:43.180 would be cool, right? 00:19:43.400 --> 00:19:47.860 maybe have a slightly different output with more information about the parts of the string. 00:19:48.380 --> 00:19:48.600 Yeah. 00:19:49.170 --> 00:19:49.300 Indeed. 00:19:49.920 --> 00:19:50.140 All right. 00:19:50.940 --> 00:19:52.960 Well, we're back to extras. 00:19:53.710 --> 00:19:55.040 I really should have put up. 00:19:55.160 --> 00:20:11.720 So one of the things I didn't cover about the t-strings, we'll get to my extra first or second, but in the T-string article, there is a link to a whole bunch of examples of other non-silly examples of t-strings. 00:20:12.120 --> 00:20:15.800 So he does Pig Latin in the article, but there's a bunch of others too. 00:20:16.140 --> 00:20:20.520 And one of them is a treatment of logging with t-strings. 00:20:20.820 --> 00:20:21.520 So check that out. 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:32.140 My extra really is I kind of went – speaking of rabbit holes, found out Monty Python and the Holy Grail turns 50 this year. 00:20:32.360 --> 00:20:34.040 So 50 years ago, Monty Python. 00:20:34.120 --> 00:20:34.900 I can't believe that. 00:20:35.580 --> 00:20:36.940 Bring out the holy hand grenade. 00:20:39.020 --> 00:20:44.620 But one of the comments in here, which is, this is, I'm linking to an Ars Technica article. 00:20:46.020 --> 00:20:54.100 And I learned a new word today because there were, it says they were, Monty Python and the Holy Grail were nerd gassing before it was cool. 00:20:54.510 --> 00:20:56.460 So they were talking about nerd gassing. 00:20:57.120 --> 00:21:04.980 And one of the wonderful discussions in the movie is using coconuts. 00:21:05.720 --> 00:21:07.620 Because they're supposedly riding horses. 00:21:07.850 --> 00:21:08.700 They don't have, yeah. 00:21:09.340 --> 00:21:11.000 Yeah, there's just some guy banging coconuts. 00:21:11.740 --> 00:21:14.740 And somebody stops and says, like, where did you get the coconuts? 00:21:14.840 --> 00:21:15.760 Oh, we found them. 00:21:16.060 --> 00:21:19.420 No, you couldn't have found them because, like, they're not native to England. 00:21:19.700 --> 00:21:20.040 They're tropical. 00:21:21.220 --> 00:21:23.360 So great discussion about coconuts. 00:21:23.780 --> 00:21:25.640 And apparently that is nerd gassing. 00:21:25.840 --> 00:21:26.940 I didn't know the term. 00:21:27.840 --> 00:21:28.620 So I looked that up. 00:21:28.840 --> 00:21:37.180 Nerd gassing was coined in 2008 by John Scalzi, a sci-fi author and blogger. 00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:55.440 And nerd gassing is the venting nerd, venting, the venting that nerds emit when some often minor detail of a book or movie or TV show, comic book, et cetera, either conflicts with canon or hand waves through some suspect science. 00:21:56.100 --> 00:22:03.940 And so I was totally nerd gassing in the, in one of our topics when I went off on what the correct rules for pig Latin 00:22:03.940 --> 00:22:04.480 are. 00:22:04.770 --> 00:22:07.420 So, yes, that's, you were. 00:22:07.800 --> 00:22:14.140 And I do the same thing when people mess up that quote from Captain Picard about may the force be with you. 00:22:14.500 --> 00:22:16.020 Okay, so let's go on to the next. 00:22:17.720 --> 00:22:17.940 Nice. 00:22:18.680 --> 00:22:18.820 Okay. 00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:19.120 Please 00:22:19.120 --> 00:22:20.620 write us and tell me that that's wrong. 00:22:20.760 --> 00:22:20.940 All right. 00:22:21.180 --> 00:22:22.540 This is it for your extras? 00:22:22.900 --> 00:22:23.040 Yeah. 00:22:23.300 --> 00:22:30.540 I would like to also point out for those as a follow-up who don't know, because Python, the community has done a poor job of this. 00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:37.280 All the logos for Python are snakes, but the name Python came from Monty Python, which is why it's relevant on this show. 00:22:37.800 --> 00:22:38.000 yes 00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:42.620 yes and that's why we have wheels because they're wheels of cheese because 00:22:42.620 --> 00:22:45.960 they used to the cheese shop for pipey and yeah the 00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:51.400 cheese skit i mean if you haven't seen the cheese skit from monty python you have to go watch the cheese skit because it's 00:22:51.400 --> 00:22:51.540 awesome 00:22:51.540 --> 00:22:52.100 the 00:22:52.100 --> 00:22:55.440 rabbit part is my favorite by far okay here's 00:22:55.440 --> 00:23:09.240 a quote this is not the joke this is actually a real thing so it has a picture of firefox and it says you either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become a villain. And underneath it, it shows the preferences in Firefox for website advertising. 00:23:10.060 --> 00:23:43.900 Allow websites to perform privacy preserving ad measurement. This helps the site understand how their ads perform, et cetera, et cetera. Like this is built into Firefox now. And there was like some terms and use changes about how the stuff you submit in Firefox is now being used and being shared and so on and oh right firefox was like one of the last bastions of privacy like real privacy the antithesis of chrome which is you know tracking and correlating and reselling everything 00:23:44.440 --> 00:23:44.960 so 00:23:44.960 --> 00:24:36.360 both you brian and me we care about these things and for example brian use vivaldi i use vivaldi quite a bit but i also started using zen zen browser that's what's actually on the screen right now. And I love Zen Browser because of it's such a clean, nice little layout. And it's based on Firefox as well. So when this stuff got announced 10 months ago or whenever it was, there was over on the Zen Browser GitHub repo, there was like, so what is Zen going to do about this? And at the time there wasn't a lot of clarity, but now Zen 1.2.1 is out and it's got some features. One of the things it says, if you go read the full release notes, it's got some new But in response to recent privacy concerns, bracket about Firefox, we've significantly strengthened Zen's privacy measures. 00:24:37.120 --> 00:24:40.840 Previously, we only disabled telemetry, but other things were being done. 00:24:41.240 --> 00:24:45.240 Now Firefox telemetry has been completely stripped out of this. 00:24:45.700 --> 00:24:56.040 Basically, they've, much like Vivaldi de-Google-ifies Chrome, Zen has had to go to the step of actually de-Mozilla-fying. 00:24:56.160 --> 00:24:57.960 I don't know, whatever, what is the term here? 00:24:58.200 --> 00:24:59.240 Extracting evil. 00:25:00.500 --> 00:25:05.620 Extracting the in poopification of, yeah. 00:25:06.040 --> 00:25:09.260 And I don't necessarily blame Firefox. 00:25:09.760 --> 00:25:10.600 They are in a tough spot. 00:25:10.820 --> 00:25:20.460 They've squandered their position quite badly for quite a long time, such that if the ruling against Google goes through, they lose 90% of their revenue overnight. 00:25:21.120 --> 00:25:21.600 That's a problem. 00:25:21.940 --> 00:25:26.940 But they're also doing good things like starting to create like docs alternatives that we've covered before. 00:25:27.360 --> 00:25:27.920 But, you know, 00:25:28.140 --> 00:25:28.660 I guess things 00:25:28.660 --> 00:25:33.260 must be, people must be resold and ads must be put upon people. 00:25:33.650 --> 00:25:35.120 And that's the way it seems to be. 00:25:35.150 --> 00:25:35.520 I don't know. 00:25:35.570 --> 00:25:36.900 I don't agree with it, but that's how it is. 00:25:37.160 --> 00:25:38.860 Anyway, I'm happy to see Zen Browser do this. 00:25:39.120 --> 00:25:39.400 Yeah. 00:25:39.720 --> 00:25:50.200 There's also a ton of cool, well, there are a handful, at least, of cool pytest plugins that I use that started in Mozilla. 00:25:50.680 --> 00:25:51.380 So, yeah. 00:25:51.740 --> 00:25:53.980 There's lots of great people that have worked there over the years. 00:25:54.340 --> 00:25:55.400 And I'm sure still do. 00:25:55.560 --> 00:25:55.720 A 00:25:55.720 --> 00:25:56.060 lot of people 00:25:56.060 --> 00:25:56.220 do. 00:25:56.410 --> 00:25:57.320 And I'm... 00:25:57.380 --> 00:26:01.380 suspect not all of them are super psyched about turning on all the ad stuff, right? 00:26:01.860 --> 00:26:08.000 Just like I'm sure there's people that still work at Google that don't think they should have removed don't be evil from their tagline. 00:26:08.750 --> 00:26:09.700 Yeah, but those people are evil. 00:26:09.910 --> 00:26:10.600 Okay, let's keep going. 00:26:11.580 --> 00:26:12.080 Just kidding. 00:26:12.440 --> 00:26:12.800 Just kidding. 00:26:13.010 --> 00:26:13.680 Please don't email me. 00:26:13.880 --> 00:26:14.540 Yeah, email him. 00:26:15.040 --> 00:26:16.340 It's Michael at... 00:26:20.220 --> 00:26:21.040 Testandcode.com. 00:26:21.120 --> 00:26:21.380 Okay. 00:26:23.420 --> 00:26:24.760 Next, or you go to jail. 00:26:24.900 --> 00:26:28.120 That was such a fun episode that we did last week. 00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:28.580 Yeah. 00:26:28.780 --> 00:26:35.420 But I pulled up this episode, not because I care about that, but I've changed the way that transcripts work. 00:26:35.510 --> 00:26:41.800 So previously we had transcripts are every word spoken for 30 minutes or however long the show is. 00:26:42.200 --> 00:26:43.940 And I thought, well, that should go on its own page. 00:26:44.050 --> 00:26:45.140 You can go and check it out. 00:26:45.320 --> 00:26:52.880 But I'd like you to be able to come to the page and hit Command-F and let you know what we said about, I don't know, AI or... 00:26:53.180 --> 00:26:56.020 We'll just pick the sponsor because it doesn't show up too many times. 00:26:56.240 --> 00:27:02.500 But now the transcripts show up on the main page just as a section farther down. 00:27:02.860 --> 00:27:03.040 You can 00:27:03.040 --> 00:27:03.620 collapse them 00:27:03.620 --> 00:27:03.980 if you like. 00:27:04.480 --> 00:27:08.160 But it lets you click on the time link anywhere and play it back 00:27:08.160 --> 00:27:08.900 as you go. 00:27:08.940 --> 00:27:13.720 So if you find something in the transcript and you're like, I just want to hear it, you just click right there and boom, off it goes. 00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:18.720 Put tons of effort into making these transcripts accurate and good. 00:27:18.800 --> 00:27:19.340 They're not perfect. 00:27:19.600 --> 00:27:20.860 Please, again, don't email me. 00:27:20.940 --> 00:27:22.160 There is an imperfection. 00:27:22.160 --> 00:27:23.680 I have discovered you were wrong. 00:27:24.040 --> 00:27:28.640 But we make a lot of effort to say things like PyPI are spelled correctly. 00:27:29.140 --> 00:27:33.760 And other words are correct in here so that when you search for them, they show up. 00:27:33.760 --> 00:27:39.140 It also powers our search engine that you can just search and even add to your browser that we've talked about before. 00:27:39.380 --> 00:27:40.700 But transcripts are slightly better. 00:27:41.100 --> 00:27:42.600 And the pages are slightly more useful. 00:27:42.820 --> 00:27:43.500 So visit the website. 00:27:43.820 --> 00:27:44.120 Yeah. 00:27:44.190 --> 00:27:50.080 And that helps us track every part of your life because we know we don't do that. 00:27:50.679 --> 00:27:54.060 just we need just one cookie to get it 00:27:54.060 --> 00:28:29.680 started no just kidding we have no cookies okay that's it for my extras joke yeah this is a this is a re-envisioning a re-envisioning of an old joke i think it's pretty good there's this person running a china shop and there's a big sign that says china shop and then above it my code base and there's a character here holding a giant angry looking bull by a nose ring. And the person holding it says, mind my friend comes in with me and the bull is labeled cursor. Welcome to the error of AI, huh? Just add that one feature. 00:28:29.960 --> 00:28:32.620 Sure. We only need 27 changes. You don't mind if we do, do we? 00:28:34.140 --> 00:28:34.980 Interesting. That's funny. 00:28:35.270 --> 00:28:47.600 So why is this a flashback? This joke actually comes from, this is the original one from when George W. Bush was president in the US and the China shop was not code-based. The China shop was social security. 00:28:48.120 --> 00:28:48.220 Okay. 00:28:48.660 --> 00:28:48.860 Yeah. 00:28:49.100 --> 00:28:49.740 Something like that. 00:28:50.020 --> 00:28:53.160 That's, I don't know, somewhere down here in this thread people talk about stuff. 00:28:53.260 --> 00:28:53.540 I don't know. 00:28:53.820 --> 00:28:55.280 Anyway, I think it's a pretty appropriate joke. 00:28:55.420 --> 00:28:55.800 It's pretty good. 00:28:56.060 --> 00:28:56.260 Yeah. 00:28:56.980 --> 00:28:57.060 Yeah. 00:28:57.460 --> 00:28:57.760 It's funny. 00:28:58.180 --> 00:28:59.100 Good, good, good point. 00:28:59.380 --> 00:28:59.460 Yeah. 00:28:59.880 --> 00:28:59.960 Indeed. 00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:00.700 Indeed. 00:29:01.340 --> 00:29:01.440 All right. 00:29:01.500 --> 00:29:02.440 Well, that's what I had for our joke. 00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:05.520 Not absolutely hilarious, but amusing, I think. 00:29:06.020 --> 00:29:09.680 If you want hilarious, you got to go back to 430, episode 430 last week. 00:29:09.880 --> 00:29:09.980 Yeah. 00:29:10.320 --> 00:29:10.480 Yeah. 00:29:10.900 --> 00:29:10.960 Yeah. 00:29:11.080 --> 00:29:13.980 And if you haven't listened to that, you have to watch that video because it's excellent. 00:29:13.980 --> 00:29:14.160 That's right. 00:29:14.820 --> 00:29:15.280 That's right. 00:29:15.860 --> 00:29:16.720 or you go to jail. 00:29:17.120 --> 00:29:17.720 Or you go 00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:18.080 to jail. 00:29:18.650 --> 00:29:19.840 Listen to it or you go to jail. 00:29:22.520 --> 00:29:23.900 Well, once again, wonderful episode. 00:29:24.320 --> 00:29:27.100 Thanks everybody for listening and we'll see everybody next week.