WEBVTT 00:00:00.001 --> 00:00:05.780 Hello and welcome to Python Bytes, where we deliver Python news and headlines directly to your earbuds. 00:00:05.780 --> 00:00:11.700 This is episode 69, recorded March 15th, 2018. I'm Michael Kennedy. 00:00:11.700 --> 00:00:12.920 And I'm Brian Okken. 00:00:12.920 --> 00:00:16.940 And Brian, probably nothing to cover with notebooks or anything. 00:00:16.940 --> 00:00:19.800 Like last time we had kind of an over-the-top notebook thing, didn't we? 00:00:19.800 --> 00:00:22.520 Yeah, we did. We covered a few topics on notebooks. 00:00:22.520 --> 00:00:24.480 Good thing. We probably won't do that again this week. 00:00:24.780 --> 00:00:27.080 I just want to say a quick thanks to DigitalOcean. 00:00:27.080 --> 00:00:30.660 They're sponsoring this episode and many of the episodes of Python Bytes. 00:00:30.660 --> 00:00:33.040 So they really are helping make the show happen. 00:00:33.040 --> 00:00:36.660 Check them out at do.co slash Python. 00:00:36.660 --> 00:00:38.320 We'll talk more about that later. 00:00:38.320 --> 00:00:40.780 Maybe we'll talk about notebooks, Brian. 00:00:40.780 --> 00:00:42.820 Yeah, let's talk about them just for a little bit. 00:00:42.820 --> 00:00:46.960 So because we talked about notebooks last time, 00:00:46.960 --> 00:00:49.900 one of our listeners contacted us and said, 00:00:50.480 --> 00:00:54.900 we should take a look at a project called PYNB. 00:00:54.900 --> 00:00:55.500 It says, 00:00:55.500 --> 00:00:59.220 Jupyter Notebooks in plain Python code with embedded markdown text. 00:00:59.220 --> 00:01:01.660 So the comment from our listener was, 00:01:01.660 --> 00:01:03.520 loves Jupyter Notebooks, 00:01:03.520 --> 00:01:06.020 but he also loves using his own editor. 00:01:06.020 --> 00:01:07.760 I think he uses PyCharm. 00:01:07.760 --> 00:01:09.720 I like doing that too, 00:01:09.720 --> 00:01:10.920 but you can't, 00:01:10.920 --> 00:01:13.820 it's like not trivial to edit. 00:01:13.820 --> 00:01:17.640 I haven't even tried to try to edit a notebook in PyCharm. 00:01:17.640 --> 00:01:18.680 You probably can, 00:01:18.680 --> 00:01:20.100 but I haven't tried. 00:01:20.100 --> 00:01:20.840 But anyway, 00:01:20.840 --> 00:01:21.560 but I, 00:01:21.560 --> 00:01:23.800 I like this idea of there's, 00:01:23.800 --> 00:01:30.720 it's basically a converter that you can convert back and forth between a plain text with, 00:01:30.720 --> 00:01:35.860 or a Python code with embedded markdown back and forth to a notebook. 00:01:35.860 --> 00:01:37.420 So it looks pretty cool. 00:01:37.420 --> 00:01:38.020 Yeah, 00:01:38.020 --> 00:01:38.860 it's pretty wild. 00:01:38.860 --> 00:01:41.040 So you define like a cells function, 00:01:41.040 --> 00:01:45.500 and then you can put like docstring type equivalent of markdown, 00:01:45.500 --> 00:01:46.400 and that becomes a cell. 00:01:46.400 --> 00:01:47.640 And then you put a little bit of Python, 00:01:47.640 --> 00:01:48.940 that becomes a Python cell. 00:01:49.020 --> 00:01:51.380 the more markdown within docstrings, 00:01:51.380 --> 00:01:52.840 and that becomes like another cell. 00:01:52.840 --> 00:01:53.680 And yeah, 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:54.340 it's super cool. 00:01:54.340 --> 00:01:55.200 So a really nice, 00:01:55.200 --> 00:01:55.720 simple example. 00:01:55.720 --> 00:01:56.560 It's quite cool. 00:01:56.560 --> 00:01:57.300 Yeah. 00:01:57.300 --> 00:01:59.000 And one of the things that it points out, 00:01:59.000 --> 00:02:00.280 which is nifty, 00:02:00.280 --> 00:02:01.960 is it allows you to, 00:02:01.960 --> 00:02:04.160 to use diffs better with, 00:02:04.160 --> 00:02:06.820 with your version control tools or things like that. 00:02:06.900 --> 00:02:07.640 So that's, 00:02:07.640 --> 00:02:08.420 yeah, 00:02:08.420 --> 00:02:09.460 it's worth checking out if you, 00:02:09.460 --> 00:02:11.360 if you want to do more with notebooks, 00:02:11.360 --> 00:02:14.120 but want to be able to store them in plain text better. 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:17.100 It's really just right down to the essence of it, 00:02:17.100 --> 00:02:17.460 isn't it? 00:02:17.460 --> 00:02:18.080 Because the notebooks, 00:02:18.080 --> 00:02:19.360 they're pretty verbose. 00:02:19.360 --> 00:02:21.560 If you crack open the text file and look at them, 00:02:21.560 --> 00:02:22.120 you know, 00:02:22.120 --> 00:02:22.660 you look at, 00:02:22.660 --> 00:02:23.600 you look at this, 00:02:23.600 --> 00:02:24.120 and it's like, 00:02:24.120 --> 00:02:26.560 literally what you would see in the notebook is like, 00:02:26.560 --> 00:02:27.080 all you type. 00:02:27.080 --> 00:02:27.640 It's pretty cool. 00:02:27.880 --> 00:02:31.560 was one of my to-do lists was to play with some notebooks a little bit. 00:02:31.560 --> 00:02:32.620 So I'll play with this also. 00:02:32.620 --> 00:02:33.320 Yeah. 00:02:33.320 --> 00:02:34.400 So PiNB, 00:02:34.400 --> 00:02:34.960 Pi Notebook, 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:35.500 check that out. 00:02:35.500 --> 00:02:35.720 Very, 00:02:35.720 --> 00:02:36.140 very cool. 00:02:36.140 --> 00:02:39.900 So you know how there's this really cool William Gibson quote, 00:02:39.900 --> 00:02:41.460 the future is already here. 00:02:41.460 --> 00:02:42.600 It's just not evenly distributed. 00:02:42.600 --> 00:02:43.300 Yeah. 00:02:43.300 --> 00:02:44.000 I love that. 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:45.040 That's a cool quote. 00:02:45.040 --> 00:02:45.240 Yeah, 00:02:45.240 --> 00:02:45.640 I do too. 00:02:45.640 --> 00:02:47.020 And I often, 00:02:47.020 --> 00:02:48.120 when I think of like, 00:02:48.120 --> 00:02:48.320 oh, 00:02:48.320 --> 00:02:49.640 where's that future we were hoping for? 00:02:49.640 --> 00:02:49.940 Well, 00:02:49.940 --> 00:02:50.340 it's not, 00:02:50.340 --> 00:02:50.880 well here. 00:02:50.880 --> 00:02:51.080 Well, 00:02:51.080 --> 00:02:51.640 maybe it is. 00:02:51.640 --> 00:02:52.980 It's just not evenly distributed. 00:02:52.980 --> 00:02:56.720 So this next thing feels like it kind of falls into that realm. 00:02:56.720 --> 00:02:57.180 And it's, 00:02:57.180 --> 00:02:57.740 it's definitely, 00:02:57.740 --> 00:03:00.480 like from the futuristic world. 00:03:00.480 --> 00:03:04.400 I don't know how far futuristic is this two years in the future, 00:03:04.400 --> 00:03:06.120 10 years or a hundred years or, 00:03:06.120 --> 00:03:07.120 or something like that. 00:03:07.120 --> 00:03:08.200 Or is it just live in science fiction? 00:03:08.200 --> 00:03:10.900 But I promise this has something to do with Python. 00:03:10.900 --> 00:03:12.320 It just takes a moment to get to it. 00:03:12.320 --> 00:03:16.880 So the announcement is that Microsoft has created a quantum computing 00:03:16.880 --> 00:03:19.120 language called Q sharp. 00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:19.800 Yeah. 00:03:19.800 --> 00:03:20.080 Okay. 00:03:20.080 --> 00:03:21.180 This just sounds neat. 00:03:21.180 --> 00:03:22.280 This is awesome. 00:03:22.280 --> 00:03:22.580 Right. 00:03:22.580 --> 00:03:23.180 Yeah. 00:03:23.180 --> 00:03:25.020 And it's been out for a little while. 00:03:25.020 --> 00:03:27.360 And we were talking before the show. 00:03:27.440 --> 00:03:27.640 It's like, 00:03:27.640 --> 00:03:29.600 it was almost worth covering before just because, 00:03:29.600 --> 00:03:30.100 wow, 00:03:30.100 --> 00:03:34.400 there's a program programming language specifically designed for quantum 00:03:34.400 --> 00:03:34.880 computers. 00:03:34.880 --> 00:03:37.240 That's a pretty nice language actually. 00:03:37.240 --> 00:03:42.740 But the news is now it's available for macOS and Linux and you can try it. 00:03:42.740 --> 00:03:43.040 Right. 00:03:43.100 --> 00:03:45.060 So there's this new language called Q sharp. 00:03:45.060 --> 00:03:46.040 And if you look at it, 00:03:46.040 --> 00:03:47.840 it's a little bit like C#. 00:03:47.840 --> 00:03:51.440 It's also a little bit like either typescript in some ways, 00:03:51.440 --> 00:03:52.600 but also like Python. 00:03:52.600 --> 00:03:57.360 And I was really pleased to see like the if statements don't have parentheses around the 00:03:57.360 --> 00:03:58.860 condition and stuff like that, 00:03:58.860 --> 00:04:00.840 because we don't need them. 00:04:00.840 --> 00:04:02.480 Why are we forced to write all those parentheses? 00:04:02.480 --> 00:04:03.860 Like they're unnecessary. 00:04:03.860 --> 00:04:07.960 We all know that from Python and Q sharp is sort of borrowing some of these cool ideas. 00:04:07.960 --> 00:04:13.540 The type annotations are very much similar to Python's type annotations as well. 00:04:13.540 --> 00:04:14.620 So quite cool. 00:04:14.620 --> 00:04:15.680 There's this new language. 00:04:15.680 --> 00:04:17.960 One of the first questions you might ask is like, 00:04:17.960 --> 00:04:18.200 great, 00:04:18.200 --> 00:04:20.400 there's this quantum computer programming language, 00:04:20.400 --> 00:04:22.200 but there's no quantum computers. 00:04:22.200 --> 00:04:24.060 So what's the point? 00:04:24.060 --> 00:04:24.300 Like, 00:04:24.300 --> 00:04:25.240 why are we going to run this? 00:04:25.280 --> 00:04:25.460 I mean, 00:04:25.460 --> 00:04:27.220 I know there's like a couple of bits, 00:04:27.220 --> 00:04:27.640 but not, 00:04:27.640 --> 00:04:31.100 you can't go and get like a quantum computer to test your program on. 00:04:31.100 --> 00:04:32.040 So how do you test it? 00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:33.000 Good question. 00:04:33.000 --> 00:04:33.540 Yeah. 00:04:33.540 --> 00:04:37.800 So they've got like this emulator type thing that emulates the behavior of a quantum computer, 00:04:37.800 --> 00:04:39.580 although I suspect it's slower than a real one. 00:04:39.580 --> 00:04:40.180 Well, 00:04:40.180 --> 00:04:40.560 are there, 00:04:40.560 --> 00:04:42.680 maybe I'm just not up to date. 00:04:42.680 --> 00:04:44.420 Are there quantum computers now? 00:04:44.420 --> 00:04:46.060 There are like, 00:04:46.060 --> 00:04:48.040 I can't remember who was, 00:04:48.040 --> 00:04:49.040 it feels like IBM, 00:04:49.040 --> 00:04:51.020 but there's like a couple of bits, 00:04:51.020 --> 00:04:53.840 like a two bit quantum computer and like, 00:04:53.840 --> 00:04:54.940 like it's super, 00:04:55.100 --> 00:04:58.640 super cold environment that can do like very simple things. 00:04:58.640 --> 00:05:00.120 So, 00:05:00.120 --> 00:05:01.940 but it's not like a general purpose, 00:05:01.940 --> 00:05:02.820 you know, 00:05:02.820 --> 00:05:04.560 unless you've got like a hydrogen bath, 00:05:04.560 --> 00:05:07.600 like liquid hydrogen bath to put it in and things like that. 00:05:07.600 --> 00:05:09.080 So it's, 00:05:09.080 --> 00:05:12.160 it's based on topological qubits and quantum computers. 00:05:12.160 --> 00:05:13.260 So hence Q sharp, 00:05:13.260 --> 00:05:15.060 and it's out from macOS and Linux. 00:05:15.060 --> 00:05:15.620 It's awesome. 00:05:15.620 --> 00:05:17.260 On windows, 00:05:17.260 --> 00:05:19.840 you can play with it in visual studio standard, 00:05:19.840 --> 00:05:21.200 but on Mac and Linux, 00:05:21.200 --> 00:05:22.700 you can use Visual Studio Code. 00:05:22.700 --> 00:05:24.120 And there's like a quantum, 00:05:24.920 --> 00:05:27.760 programming code extension for Visual Studio Codes. 00:05:27.760 --> 00:05:28.380 That's pretty cool. 00:05:28.380 --> 00:05:29.380 Yeah. 00:05:29.560 --> 00:05:32.260 And so you're saying that this ties into Python somehow. 00:05:32.260 --> 00:05:33.300 Somehow. 00:05:33.300 --> 00:05:34.160 In fact, 00:05:34.160 --> 00:05:34.720 so they said, 00:05:34.720 --> 00:05:34.880 all right, 00:05:34.880 --> 00:05:37.620 we created this new language and we created this way to emulate it. 00:05:37.620 --> 00:05:40.060 And there's actually some stuff in their cloud computing platform, 00:05:40.060 --> 00:05:40.460 Azure, 00:05:40.460 --> 00:05:42.780 where like you can plug in these things. 00:05:42.780 --> 00:05:44.840 So like they all tie together in interesting ways, 00:05:44.840 --> 00:05:45.780 but they said, 00:05:45.780 --> 00:05:46.040 look, 00:05:46.100 --> 00:05:47.780 we know other languages exist. 00:05:47.780 --> 00:05:49.240 And they're really important. 00:05:49.240 --> 00:05:51.920 The one language we think is so important. 00:05:51.920 --> 00:05:53.600 It should be involved in this as well as Python. 00:05:53.600 --> 00:05:55.680 So you can now, 00:05:55.680 --> 00:05:57.280 you can now call, 00:05:57.280 --> 00:06:00.260 use Python to program quantum computers. 00:06:00.940 --> 00:06:01.400 Oh, 00:06:01.400 --> 00:06:02.180 that is awesome. 00:06:02.180 --> 00:06:02.600 Yeah. 00:06:02.600 --> 00:06:03.040 That's awesome. 00:06:03.040 --> 00:06:03.240 Right. 00:06:03.240 --> 00:06:03.900 You know, 00:06:03.900 --> 00:06:05.560 emulated quantum computers, 00:06:05.560 --> 00:06:06.820 but still super awesome. 00:06:06.820 --> 00:06:07.560 And they said, 00:06:07.560 --> 00:06:07.760 Oh, 00:06:07.760 --> 00:06:10.520 and a lot of this analysis has to do with like data science type stuff. 00:06:10.520 --> 00:06:12.140 So we'll also support Jupyter. 00:06:12.140 --> 00:06:12.920 Yeah. 00:06:12.940 --> 00:06:17.520 I predict a whole bunch of like people in college doing their thesis on this 00:06:17.520 --> 00:06:18.320 stuff like this. 00:06:18.320 --> 00:06:19.020 Yeah. 00:06:19.020 --> 00:06:19.820 That's a really good point. 00:06:19.820 --> 00:06:20.280 Put the, 00:06:20.280 --> 00:06:20.640 the, 00:06:20.640 --> 00:06:20.980 the, 00:06:20.980 --> 00:06:23.100 the sciencey aspect back in computer science, 00:06:23.100 --> 00:06:23.300 right? 00:06:23.300 --> 00:06:23.800 Yeah, 00:06:23.800 --> 00:06:24.300 definitely. 00:06:24.300 --> 00:06:25.040 That'd be neat. 00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:27.580 So do you speak Spanish, 00:06:27.580 --> 00:06:27.780 Brian? 00:06:27.780 --> 00:06:28.820 I, 00:06:28.820 --> 00:06:29.440 you know, 00:06:29.440 --> 00:06:30.840 this is embarrassing. 00:06:30.840 --> 00:06:32.420 I took two years of it in high school, 00:06:32.420 --> 00:06:34.580 but I barely can order a burrito. 00:06:34.580 --> 00:06:35.920 Yeah. 00:06:35.920 --> 00:06:37.180 My Spanish is not very good, 00:06:37.180 --> 00:06:38.380 but one of, 00:06:38.380 --> 00:06:39.300 there is, 00:06:39.300 --> 00:06:40.240 there is a fellow, 00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:40.740 um, 00:06:40.740 --> 00:06:41.740 a Valbana, 00:06:41.740 --> 00:06:42.780 I think is his name. 00:06:43.260 --> 00:06:43.660 Um, 00:06:43.660 --> 00:06:45.420 that does speak Spanish. 00:06:45.420 --> 00:06:53.460 And he gave a talk at PyCon ES in 2017 about pytest and let me know about it and, 00:06:53.460 --> 00:06:53.820 uh, 00:06:53.820 --> 00:06:55.260 showed me the slides and, 00:06:55.260 --> 00:06:56.480 and this was kind of cool. 00:06:56.480 --> 00:06:58.180 He sent it to me on Twitter and said, 00:06:58.180 --> 00:06:58.440 Hey, 00:06:58.440 --> 00:06:58.840 um, 00:06:58.840 --> 00:07:00.000 I forgot to tell you, 00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:03.460 I gave this talk last year and I think it was in September. 00:07:03.460 --> 00:07:04.380 And, 00:07:04.380 --> 00:07:04.780 uh, 00:07:04.780 --> 00:07:05.420 and I said, 00:07:05.420 --> 00:07:06.760 that looks really cool. 00:07:06.760 --> 00:07:08.140 There's a lot of neat stuff in it. 00:07:08.140 --> 00:07:09.140 Unfortunately, 00:07:09.140 --> 00:07:11.200 I don't speak Spanish. 00:07:11.200 --> 00:07:11.860 Um, 00:07:11.860 --> 00:07:13.080 but neat anyway. 00:07:13.080 --> 00:07:14.000 And he said, 00:07:14.000 --> 00:07:14.220 Oh, 00:07:14.220 --> 00:07:15.440 let me translate it for you. 00:07:15.440 --> 00:07:18.960 So he translated the slide deck for me and the slide deck. 00:07:18.960 --> 00:07:20.480 We have a link to the English slides. 00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:21.320 Um, 00:07:21.320 --> 00:07:21.960 and there's also, 00:07:21.960 --> 00:07:24.240 if you speak Spanish or want to watch anyway, 00:07:24.240 --> 00:07:25.000 um, 00:07:25.000 --> 00:07:26.980 there's a video on YouTube that we'll link to. 00:07:27.260 --> 00:07:28.340 but one of the things I, 00:07:28.340 --> 00:07:33.540 one of the reasons I wanted to bring it up is because there's some neat things in there that I'd never heard of before. 00:07:33.540 --> 00:07:35.640 There's some that I have and some that I haven't. 00:07:35.640 --> 00:07:36.540 Like for instance, 00:07:36.540 --> 00:07:37.600 he does talk about, 00:07:37.600 --> 00:07:38.280 uh, 00:07:38.280 --> 00:07:39.440 using pytest Django. 00:07:39.680 --> 00:07:40.280 So how to, 00:07:40.280 --> 00:07:40.280 how to, 00:07:40.280 --> 00:07:41.800 how to hook up pytest with, 00:07:41.800 --> 00:07:42.040 uh, 00:07:42.040 --> 00:07:43.640 Django models and stuff. 00:07:43.640 --> 00:07:46.780 And then a thing called model mommy, 00:07:46.780 --> 00:07:48.980 which is a way to mock out, 00:07:48.980 --> 00:07:49.280 uh, 00:07:49.280 --> 00:07:50.140 Django models. 00:07:50.140 --> 00:07:50.700 Uh, 00:07:50.700 --> 00:07:51.540 haven't heard of that. 00:07:51.540 --> 00:07:57.120 One of the things that doesn't get that I need to talk about in full length on my podcast is, 00:07:57.120 --> 00:07:57.380 uh, 00:07:57.380 --> 00:07:58.920 I test lazy fixture, 00:07:58.920 --> 00:07:59.960 which is, 00:07:59.960 --> 00:08:00.300 um, 00:08:00.740 --> 00:08:03.800 it's probably soon to be one of the recommended ways to, 00:08:03.800 --> 00:08:11.380 to have fixtures be able to go into a test function parameterized input. 00:08:11.380 --> 00:08:12.180 Anyway, 00:08:12.180 --> 00:08:12.980 it's a, 00:08:12.980 --> 00:08:14.520 it takes a bit of explaining, 00:08:14.520 --> 00:08:16.100 but then there's some fun, 00:08:16.100 --> 00:08:17.240 also some fun things. 00:08:17.240 --> 00:08:17.960 Uh, 00:08:17.960 --> 00:08:22.820 freeze gun is a way to freeze time for your testing into a specific spot. 00:08:22.820 --> 00:08:23.400 And the interface, 00:08:23.400 --> 00:08:24.820 it looks really cool on freeze gun. 00:08:24.820 --> 00:08:25.400 That's cool. 00:08:25.400 --> 00:08:25.700 That, 00:08:25.700 --> 00:08:26.760 I love the names here, 00:08:26.760 --> 00:08:28.120 the model mommy and the freeze gun. 00:08:28.120 --> 00:08:28.620 These are great. 00:08:28.620 --> 00:08:29.400 Yeah. 00:08:29.500 --> 00:08:31.360 And then a package called eradicate, 00:08:31.360 --> 00:08:32.180 which, 00:08:32.180 --> 00:08:32.600 um, 00:08:32.600 --> 00:08:36.220 like removes all the comments out of some code because, 00:08:36.220 --> 00:08:36.720 you know, 00:08:36.720 --> 00:08:40.140 sometimes code is easier to read if you remove the comments. 00:08:40.140 --> 00:08:41.920 So that's fun. 00:08:41.920 --> 00:08:44.980 Code comments are deodorant for code spells, 00:08:44.980 --> 00:08:46.220 right? 00:08:46.220 --> 00:08:48.760 They're there to explain why your code is fully written. 00:08:48.760 --> 00:08:49.080 Right. 00:08:49.080 --> 00:08:53.040 So a lot of the times if they're not full on documentation meant for like a help statement. 00:08:53.040 --> 00:08:53.340 Yeah, 00:08:53.340 --> 00:08:53.980 I totally agree. 00:08:53.980 --> 00:08:54.420 That's awesome. 00:08:54.420 --> 00:08:55.320 Anyway, 00:08:55.320 --> 00:08:55.820 those are, 00:08:55.820 --> 00:08:56.960 those are some fun things. 00:08:56.960 --> 00:08:59.000 So I wanted to bring it up and then a bonus topic, 00:08:59.100 --> 00:08:59.320 uh, 00:08:59.320 --> 00:09:01.500 just today was announced that, 00:09:01.500 --> 00:09:01.880 um, 00:09:01.880 --> 00:09:05.080 by test.org added a reference page, 00:09:05.080 --> 00:09:07.340 which has a one page reference, 00:09:07.340 --> 00:09:09.180 full reference to the by test API. 00:09:09.180 --> 00:09:10.140 Oh, 00:09:10.140 --> 00:09:10.540 that's cool. 00:09:10.540 --> 00:09:10.800 All, 00:09:10.800 --> 00:09:11.640 all in one place. 00:09:11.640 --> 00:09:12.520 Yeah. 00:09:12.520 --> 00:09:13.040 Super nice. 00:09:13.460 --> 00:09:13.960 All right. 00:09:13.960 --> 00:09:16.080 Speaking about stuff in one place, 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:19.720 let me tell you about digital ocean and a cool feature they have. 00:09:19.720 --> 00:09:20.000 So, 00:09:20.000 --> 00:09:20.460 you know, 00:09:20.460 --> 00:09:22.340 that you can go to digital ocean and create virtual machines, 00:09:22.340 --> 00:09:22.560 right? 00:09:22.560 --> 00:09:23.840 Like Linux servers and stuff. 00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:24.260 Yeah. 00:09:24.260 --> 00:09:24.960 Yeah. 00:09:24.960 --> 00:09:25.220 So, 00:09:25.220 --> 00:09:26.020 you know, 00:09:26.020 --> 00:09:27.600 that's just the start a lot of time. 00:09:27.600 --> 00:09:30.840 What if you want to run get lab or you want to like set up MongoDB, 00:09:30.840 --> 00:09:34.140 or you're going to run like a discourse server, 00:09:34.140 --> 00:09:35.660 you got to install Ruby, 00:09:35.660 --> 00:09:37.120 you got to install the whole discourse stuff, 00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:37.700 the database, 00:09:37.700 --> 00:09:38.140 et cetera. 00:09:38.140 --> 00:09:40.400 So one of the things you can do at digital ocean, 00:09:40.400 --> 00:09:42.540 and when you go to create a new machine, 00:09:42.540 --> 00:09:43.320 they call them droplets, 00:09:43.320 --> 00:09:45.100 as you can create these one clip apps, 00:09:45.100 --> 00:09:46.160 one click apps. 00:09:46.300 --> 00:09:47.340 So I can click over here and say, 00:09:47.340 --> 00:09:48.840 I would like to click and say, 00:09:48.840 --> 00:09:49.180 boom, 00:09:49.180 --> 00:09:50.580 new discourse server, 00:09:50.580 --> 00:09:51.080 all set up, 00:09:51.080 --> 00:09:52.360 configure it and save, 00:09:52.360 --> 00:09:52.640 go. 00:09:52.640 --> 00:09:53.780 I want a new ghost server, 00:09:53.780 --> 00:09:54.100 go. 00:09:54.100 --> 00:09:55.640 I want a new WordPress instance, 00:09:55.640 --> 00:09:55.960 go. 00:09:55.960 --> 00:09:57.760 And just click it and it's up and running. 00:09:57.760 --> 00:09:58.220 It's pretty awesome. 00:09:58.220 --> 00:09:59.160 Really? 00:09:59.160 --> 00:09:59.920 Okay. 00:09:59.920 --> 00:10:00.480 That's neat. 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:01.040 Yeah. 00:10:01.040 --> 00:10:01.760 You can even do Docker. 00:10:01.760 --> 00:10:02.880 Like you want a Docker server, 00:10:02.880 --> 00:10:03.200 boom, 00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:05.900 hit that button and you've got Docker 17, 00:10:05.900 --> 00:10:06.760 12 running. 00:10:06.760 --> 00:10:08.060 Yeah. 00:10:08.060 --> 00:10:08.760 On Ubuntu 1604. 00:10:08.760 --> 00:10:09.960 Perfect. 00:10:09.960 --> 00:10:10.480 Neat. 00:10:10.480 --> 00:10:12.540 I'll have to check out all the one click things they've got. 00:10:12.540 --> 00:10:13.380 Sounds cool. 00:10:13.380 --> 00:10:13.660 Yeah. 00:10:13.660 --> 00:10:16.220 So they got a bunch of stuff that helps you get going in a, 00:10:16.220 --> 00:10:16.920 a nice way. 00:10:16.920 --> 00:10:18.000 So check that out. 00:10:18.000 --> 00:10:20.900 D O C O slash D O dot C O slash Python. 00:10:20.900 --> 00:10:23.280 And let them know that they are doing the right thing, 00:10:23.280 --> 00:10:23.920 supporting our show. 00:10:23.920 --> 00:10:24.580 Great. 00:10:24.580 --> 00:10:27.060 It is once again, 00:10:27.060 --> 00:10:30.980 that season in which the stack of workflow developer survey results come 00:10:30.980 --> 00:10:31.180 back, 00:10:31.180 --> 00:10:31.600 come out. 00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:35.380 So the 2018 developer survey results are out. 00:10:35.380 --> 00:10:37.260 They said they had a hundred thousand, 00:10:37.260 --> 00:10:39.440 over a hundred thousand developers this time. 00:10:39.440 --> 00:10:41.280 I think last year they had 64,000. 00:10:41.280 --> 00:10:42.080 So this is cool. 00:10:42.080 --> 00:10:42.520 It's growing. 00:10:42.520 --> 00:10:45.560 And I thought it'd be fun to just cover some of the, 00:10:45.560 --> 00:10:45.980 um, 00:10:45.980 --> 00:10:46.740 high points. 00:10:46.740 --> 00:10:52.520 They spent a lot of time actually talking about like history of education. 00:10:52.520 --> 00:10:52.920 You know, 00:10:52.920 --> 00:10:58.280 like how much education level did your parents have a lot of that kind of social 00:10:58.280 --> 00:10:59.040 stuff. 00:10:59.040 --> 00:10:59.580 Interesting. 00:10:59.580 --> 00:10:59.960 That, 00:10:59.960 --> 00:11:00.920 that sounds neat. 00:11:00.920 --> 00:11:01.320 Yeah. 00:11:01.400 --> 00:11:01.520 Yeah. 00:11:01.520 --> 00:11:02.320 It's pretty interesting. 00:11:02.320 --> 00:11:02.720 Like, 00:11:02.720 --> 00:11:03.300 um, 00:11:03.300 --> 00:11:03.920 yeah, 00:11:03.920 --> 00:11:04.440 things like that. 00:11:04.440 --> 00:11:05.180 There's a bunch of that, 00:11:05.180 --> 00:11:08.340 but I'm going to focus mostly on like the tech tech bits. 00:11:08.340 --> 00:11:10.120 So first, 00:11:10.120 --> 00:11:12.220 one of the first questions they asked was about open source. 00:11:12.220 --> 00:11:12.600 And they said, 00:11:12.660 --> 00:11:19.460 how many of you contribute to open source and 55% of professional developers contribute to 00:11:19.460 --> 00:11:19.920 open source. 00:11:19.920 --> 00:11:21.820 That's higher than I would have expected. 00:11:21.820 --> 00:11:22.300 That's awesome. 00:11:22.300 --> 00:11:22.480 Yeah. 00:11:22.480 --> 00:11:22.960 Yeah. 00:11:22.960 --> 00:11:23.520 It's really awesome. 00:11:23.520 --> 00:11:24.640 I think for, 00:11:24.640 --> 00:11:25.040 uh, 00:11:25.040 --> 00:11:26.040 all respondents, 00:11:26.040 --> 00:11:28.360 there were some students and stuff and people who retired. 00:11:28.360 --> 00:11:29.380 So it was slightly higher. 00:11:29.380 --> 00:11:30.400 It's not surprising, 00:11:30.400 --> 00:11:33.980 but I thought the professional 55% was like the most interesting there. 00:11:33.980 --> 00:11:38.920 And then people often feel like if they didn't get a computer science degree in school, 00:11:38.920 --> 00:11:43.260 like they don't necessarily belong in programming or it's hard for them to get into programming, 00:11:43.440 --> 00:11:46.880 but it turns out that only 64% of the people have CS degrees. 00:11:46.880 --> 00:11:47.940 That's actually, 00:11:47.940 --> 00:11:48.340 um, 00:11:48.340 --> 00:11:48.640 yeah, 00:11:48.640 --> 00:11:50.800 I think that that's actually seems high to me. 00:11:50.800 --> 00:11:51.140 Um, 00:11:51.140 --> 00:11:55.200 there's only about a third or less of the people I work with have CS degrees. 00:11:55.200 --> 00:11:56.000 Yeah, 00:11:56.000 --> 00:11:56.340 I agree. 00:11:56.340 --> 00:11:58.680 I think that seems even high for my experience as well. 00:11:58.680 --> 00:12:01.180 Maybe CS degree people spend a lot of time on stack overflow. 00:12:01.180 --> 00:12:01.880 I don't know. 00:12:01.880 --> 00:12:02.460 Maybe, 00:12:02.460 --> 00:12:04.800 but why are they spending so much time? 00:12:04.800 --> 00:12:06.460 Because supposedly they have a degree. 00:12:06.460 --> 00:12:07.340 Exactly. 00:12:07.340 --> 00:12:07.800 Come on. 00:12:07.800 --> 00:12:08.960 Uh, 00:12:08.960 --> 00:12:09.880 so one of the, 00:12:09.880 --> 00:12:10.380 um, 00:12:10.380 --> 00:12:13.420 one of the social things they talked about was sort of the sense of, 00:12:13.420 --> 00:12:14.020 belonging. 00:12:14.020 --> 00:12:14.980 Oh, 00:12:14.980 --> 00:12:15.380 nice. 00:12:15.380 --> 00:12:18.260 People's perspective as developers among their peers. 00:12:18.260 --> 00:12:19.720 So they taught, 00:12:19.720 --> 00:12:21.760 they put that under the manner of experience and belonging. 00:12:21.760 --> 00:12:22.180 And they said, 00:12:22.180 --> 00:12:24.420 they had a graph and they said, 00:12:24.420 --> 00:12:24.680 okay, 00:12:24.680 --> 00:12:27.160 how much do you feel this is, 00:12:27.160 --> 00:12:28.740 is true or false over time? 00:12:28.740 --> 00:12:31.160 Like how much does this apply to you over time? 00:12:31.160 --> 00:12:31.380 Well, 00:12:31.380 --> 00:12:31.900 not over time, 00:12:31.900 --> 00:12:35.120 but if you've had one year experience versus a people with five year experience, 00:12:35.120 --> 00:12:35.960 versus people with 10 years, 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:38.620 there's like a graph over years of experience and, 00:12:38.620 --> 00:12:39.420 and this metric. 00:12:39.420 --> 00:12:40.760 So they said, 00:12:40.760 --> 00:12:41.420 uh, 00:12:41.420 --> 00:12:44.240 your connection and sense of community with other developers. 00:12:44.240 --> 00:12:47.600 And apparently the more time you spend in the programming world, 00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:48.200 the more that, 00:12:48.200 --> 00:12:48.680 you know, 00:12:48.680 --> 00:12:49.000 matches, 00:12:49.000 --> 00:12:49.840 which makes sense. 00:12:49.840 --> 00:12:50.020 Right. 00:12:50.020 --> 00:12:50.820 But they, 00:12:50.820 --> 00:12:51.720 they also said, 00:12:51.720 --> 00:12:52.380 uh, 00:12:52.380 --> 00:12:56.000 how much do you feel like you're competing with your peers instead of actually 00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:57.020 working together? 00:12:57.020 --> 00:12:57.220 Right. 00:12:57.220 --> 00:12:59.000 How much do you see it as a zero sum game? 00:12:59.000 --> 00:12:59.340 I guess. 00:12:59.340 --> 00:13:00.520 And at, 00:13:00.520 --> 00:13:01.220 in the beginning, 00:13:01.220 --> 00:13:04.980 it's people feel quite high that it's like direct competition. 00:13:04.980 --> 00:13:06.740 That person gets more recognition. 00:13:06.740 --> 00:13:07.400 I get less, 00:13:07.400 --> 00:13:08.340 they get a raise. 00:13:08.420 --> 00:13:08.880 I don't, 00:13:08.880 --> 00:13:09.880 I don't know something like that, 00:13:09.880 --> 00:13:12.140 but over time that diminishes quite significantly. 00:13:12.140 --> 00:13:12.880 That's good. 00:13:12.880 --> 00:13:13.660 Same thing for, 00:13:13.660 --> 00:13:14.020 yeah, 00:13:14.020 --> 00:13:14.600 for sure. 00:13:14.600 --> 00:13:18.760 And then also the feeling of I'm not as good of a programmer as my peers 00:13:18.760 --> 00:13:20.160 pretty high at the beginning. 00:13:20.160 --> 00:13:20.920 Over time, 00:13:20.920 --> 00:13:23.820 people feel less and less and less like that's a true statement, 00:13:23.820 --> 00:13:25.400 which I thought it was good as well. 00:13:25.400 --> 00:13:25.740 I mean, 00:13:25.740 --> 00:13:28.480 it seems to me like all of these are going in the right direction, 00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:30.020 the longer you're in programming, 00:13:30.020 --> 00:13:33.540 which is a positive statement for the whole ecosystem. 00:13:34.080 --> 00:13:34.160 Yeah. 00:13:34.160 --> 00:13:34.380 So, 00:13:34.380 --> 00:13:38.140 but it also shows that we need to try to teach students, 00:13:38.140 --> 00:13:41.240 try to get that connectedness and the less, 00:13:41.240 --> 00:13:43.040 less competitiveness. 00:13:43.040 --> 00:13:44.620 Teach that earlier. 00:13:44.620 --> 00:13:45.140 Yeah. 00:13:45.140 --> 00:13:45.600 Right away. 00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:46.040 Right away. 00:13:46.040 --> 00:13:49.100 You want a kind of a bleak statement that totally applies to me. 00:13:49.100 --> 00:13:50.420 How much time do you spend on computers? 00:13:50.420 --> 00:13:52.500 The most popular answer, 00:13:52.500 --> 00:13:54.340 nine to 12 hours a day. 00:13:54.340 --> 00:13:56.320 Does that include your phone? 00:13:56.320 --> 00:13:59.140 I think it might even be behind a screen. 00:13:59.140 --> 00:14:00.020 I'm not entirely sure, 00:14:00.100 --> 00:14:02.800 but if like you kick back and play games or watch Netflix or whatever, 00:14:02.800 --> 00:14:08.680 it was also notable that the usage of Python has exceeded C# for the 00:14:08.680 --> 00:14:09.100 first time. 00:14:09.100 --> 00:14:10.240 They called that out specifically, 00:14:10.240 --> 00:14:10.680 I think. 00:14:10.680 --> 00:14:11.200 Yeah. 00:14:11.200 --> 00:14:11.800 Cool. 00:14:11.800 --> 00:14:16.800 Then the couple more things like there's languages and databases. 00:14:16.800 --> 00:14:18.180 They talk about the most loved, 00:14:18.180 --> 00:14:20.140 the most dreaded and the most wanted. 00:14:20.140 --> 00:14:22.220 So most love is you're using it and you love it. 00:14:22.220 --> 00:14:24.420 Dreaded is like you've had to use it or you've never, 00:14:24.420 --> 00:14:25.160 ever want to use it. 00:14:25.160 --> 00:14:26.080 It gives you fear. 00:14:26.080 --> 00:14:28.020 And then wanted is I'm not yet using it, 00:14:28.020 --> 00:14:29.080 but I want to use it. 00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:31.180 So these are all interesting ways to measure things. 00:14:31.180 --> 00:14:32.960 So languages most love. 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:33.960 Number one is rust, 00:14:33.960 --> 00:14:36.860 even though not that many people use it among the people who use it. 00:14:36.860 --> 00:14:37.740 They love it so much. 00:14:37.740 --> 00:14:38.100 Apparently, 00:14:38.100 --> 00:14:40.900 Kotlin is number two and Python is number three. 00:14:40.900 --> 00:14:42.020 Pretty nice. 00:14:42.020 --> 00:14:42.300 Okay. 00:14:42.300 --> 00:14:42.780 Yeah. 00:14:42.780 --> 00:14:45.220 Dreaded VB six and coffee script. 00:14:45.220 --> 00:14:45.880 Keep away. 00:14:45.880 --> 00:14:47.160 Wanted. 00:14:47.160 --> 00:14:49.120 Python is number one, 00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:51.720 the most wanted language by 25%. 00:14:51.720 --> 00:14:53.400 Number two is JavaScript at 19, 00:14:53.400 --> 00:14:54.300 which is quite a drop. 00:14:54.300 --> 00:14:56.240 And then go is at 16%. 00:14:56.240 --> 00:14:57.780 So it drops off really quick. 00:14:57.780 --> 00:14:59.280 And Python is sort of ruling that. 00:14:59.820 --> 00:15:00.040 Yeah. 00:15:00.040 --> 00:15:00.720 That's great. 00:15:00.720 --> 00:15:01.160 Yeah. 00:15:01.160 --> 00:15:02.240 Databases. 00:15:02.240 --> 00:15:02.580 Yeah. 00:15:02.580 --> 00:15:03.060 Databases. 00:15:03.060 --> 00:15:03.940 Most love Postgres. 00:15:03.940 --> 00:15:05.820 Most dreaded is IBM DB2. 00:15:05.820 --> 00:15:07.320 Memcached in Oracle. 00:15:07.320 --> 00:15:12.840 And Memcached was responsible for the largest distributed denial of service attack ever. 00:15:12.840 --> 00:15:15.140 And that was put onto GitHub recently. 00:15:15.140 --> 00:15:15.480 So, 00:15:15.480 --> 00:15:16.740 and then most wanted is MongoDB. 00:15:16.740 --> 00:15:18.640 A most popular editor, 00:15:18.640 --> 00:15:19.760 Visual Studio Code. 00:15:19.760 --> 00:15:20.540 Pretty interesting. 00:15:20.540 --> 00:15:21.140 Yeah. 00:15:21.380 --> 00:15:22.560 And for developers, 00:15:22.560 --> 00:15:23.680 what OS do they use? 00:15:23.680 --> 00:15:24.300 Last thing. 00:15:24.300 --> 00:15:25.060 Windows, 00:15:25.060 --> 00:15:26.480 49%. 00:15:26.480 --> 00:15:27.440 macOS, 00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:28.260 27%. 00:15:28.260 --> 00:15:28.540 Linux, 00:15:28.540 --> 00:15:29.260 23%. 00:15:29.260 --> 00:15:30.420 Not where they deploy to, 00:15:30.420 --> 00:15:32.340 but what do they write their code on? 00:15:32.340 --> 00:15:33.240 That, 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:36.000 and this is one that we need to pay attention to more, 00:15:36.000 --> 00:15:36.480 I think. 00:15:36.480 --> 00:15:37.720 Because, 00:15:37.720 --> 00:15:38.220 um, 00:15:38.300 --> 00:15:38.960 of all the, 00:15:38.960 --> 00:15:39.520 a lot of the, 00:15:39.520 --> 00:15:44.340 the podcasters and bloggers and all of that within the Python community, 00:15:44.340 --> 00:15:45.040 I think, 00:15:45.040 --> 00:15:45.400 uh, 00:15:45.400 --> 00:15:47.580 either Linux or macOS might be, 00:15:47.580 --> 00:15:48.120 uh, 00:15:48.120 --> 00:15:48.600 higher. 00:15:48.600 --> 00:15:49.480 Much higher. 00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:54.680 but you're teaching to a group of people that half of them are running Windows. 00:15:54.680 --> 00:15:56.420 So you just can't ignore Windows. 00:15:56.420 --> 00:15:57.100 Yeah. 00:15:57.100 --> 00:15:57.440 It's, 00:15:57.440 --> 00:15:58.820 it's a really good point that like, 00:15:58.820 --> 00:16:02.240 even though it's sort of the thought leaders and the people who see at conferences and, 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:05.060 and speakers and whatnot are probably either Linux or Mac, 00:16:05.060 --> 00:16:08.840 the actual people doing the work and using the stuff is, 00:16:08.840 --> 00:16:10.700 is very much Windows still. 00:16:10.700 --> 00:16:12.260 So definitely not to be forgotten. 00:16:12.260 --> 00:16:13.520 Speaking of presenting. 00:16:13.520 --> 00:16:15.180 Speaking of presenting, 00:16:15.180 --> 00:16:16.260 um, 00:16:16.260 --> 00:16:17.020 Doug Hellman, 00:16:17.020 --> 00:16:17.700 um, 00:16:17.940 --> 00:16:19.720 he came up with, 00:16:19.720 --> 00:16:21.420 and there's got a new project, 00:16:21.420 --> 00:16:22.040 um, 00:16:22.040 --> 00:16:23.400 called Demo Shell. 00:16:23.400 --> 00:16:26.100 And the idea is, 00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:26.620 um, 00:16:26.620 --> 00:16:30.400 it came out like somebody named Gene Hack on Twitter said, 00:16:30.400 --> 00:16:30.720 um, 00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:31.280 Hey speakers, 00:16:31.280 --> 00:16:33.160 if you're going to do live demos in a shell, 00:16:33.160 --> 00:16:37.620 clear the screen after every command and get the prompt back to the top. 00:16:37.620 --> 00:16:40.120 So folks in the back can see what you're doing. 00:16:40.120 --> 00:16:42.040 And that's, 00:16:42.040 --> 00:16:42.520 uh, 00:16:42.520 --> 00:16:43.700 completely reasonable. 00:16:43.700 --> 00:16:44.240 Yeah, 00:16:44.240 --> 00:16:44.920 it's a great idea. 00:16:44.920 --> 00:16:46.760 But instead of fiddling with it, 00:16:46.760 --> 00:16:47.200 um, 00:16:47.320 --> 00:16:48.340 so this, 00:16:48.340 --> 00:16:48.560 uh, 00:16:48.560 --> 00:16:49.740 demo shell is this site. 00:16:49.740 --> 00:16:51.920 The idea is basically just to do that, 00:16:51.920 --> 00:16:52.660 to capture, 00:16:52.660 --> 00:16:53.060 um, 00:16:53.060 --> 00:16:54.300 a Python project, 00:16:54.300 --> 00:16:57.400 to capture your input and emulate a shell. 00:16:57.400 --> 00:17:00.620 But it really just pushes all the work off to a shell to do the work. 00:17:00.620 --> 00:17:01.260 But, 00:17:01.260 --> 00:17:01.580 um, 00:17:01.580 --> 00:17:02.740 but between commands, 00:17:02.740 --> 00:17:03.100 uh, 00:17:03.100 --> 00:17:06.300 puts your prompt back at the top and it's, 00:17:06.300 --> 00:17:06.520 um, 00:17:06.520 --> 00:17:08.160 it's in its very early stages. 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:08.600 So, 00:17:08.600 --> 00:17:09.060 um, 00:17:09.060 --> 00:17:11.220 I actually reached out to Doug and said, 00:17:11.220 --> 00:17:11.820 Hey, 00:17:11.820 --> 00:17:13.520 do you want me to announce this yet? 00:17:13.520 --> 00:17:14.020 Are you, 00:17:14.020 --> 00:17:15.620 you ready for it? 00:17:15.620 --> 00:17:16.000 And he said, 00:17:16.000 --> 00:17:16.240 yeah, 00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:17.900 I put it up there to start the discussion. 00:17:17.900 --> 00:17:20.220 Be happy if a bunch of people showed up and, 00:17:20.220 --> 00:17:20.440 uh, 00:17:20.440 --> 00:17:20.780 started, 00:17:20.780 --> 00:17:21.140 uh, 00:17:21.140 --> 00:17:22.880 participating and adding things. 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:23.580 But, 00:17:23.580 --> 00:17:23.860 uh, 00:17:23.860 --> 00:17:26.000 he added a warning also that, 00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:26.320 um, 00:17:26.320 --> 00:17:30.440 too much interest is going to be met with commit privileges on the repo. 00:17:30.440 --> 00:17:31.700 Essentially, 00:17:31.700 --> 00:17:33.320 if you want stuff done, 00:17:33.320 --> 00:17:34.180 he might say, 00:17:34.180 --> 00:17:34.860 Hey, 00:17:34.860 --> 00:17:36.240 just go ahead and do it. 00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:36.720 Um, 00:17:36.720 --> 00:17:38.620 but actually that's a good thing. 00:17:38.620 --> 00:17:39.160 He's up, 00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:40.600 he's up for people to help him out. 00:17:40.600 --> 00:17:40.940 So, 00:17:40.940 --> 00:17:41.500 yeah, 00:17:41.500 --> 00:17:42.740 I think it's really neat. 00:17:42.740 --> 00:17:43.480 It's a cool idea. 00:17:43.480 --> 00:17:45.340 It definitely makes a lot of sense. 00:17:45.340 --> 00:17:48.940 I've done so many training classes where it's not like stadium seating. 00:17:48.940 --> 00:17:49.920 It's like flat, 00:17:49.920 --> 00:17:50.240 right? 00:17:50.240 --> 00:17:54.400 And it's usually in some room with a crappy projector screen. 00:17:54.400 --> 00:17:55.360 That's like too small, 00:17:55.360 --> 00:17:56.620 like a third of it's off, 00:17:56.620 --> 00:17:57.060 you know, 00:17:57.060 --> 00:17:58.540 people in the back can't see it at all. 00:17:58.840 --> 00:17:59.680 And this is perfect, 00:17:59.680 --> 00:17:59.900 right? 00:17:59.900 --> 00:18:00.180 You just, 00:18:00.180 --> 00:18:01.520 everything stays at the top. 00:18:01.520 --> 00:18:02.280 It's really great. 00:18:02.280 --> 00:18:05.860 And people out there looking to find an open source project to work on, 00:18:05.860 --> 00:18:06.840 right? 00:18:06.840 --> 00:18:08.080 Go and express some interest. 00:18:08.080 --> 00:18:10.920 You might be met with commit privileges on the repo, 00:18:10.920 --> 00:18:11.820 but it's, 00:18:11.820 --> 00:18:13.620 it's still in its really small stages. 00:18:13.620 --> 00:18:14.860 There's not a lot of code there, 00:18:14.860 --> 00:18:16.180 so it's pretty easy to read. 00:18:16.180 --> 00:18:16.880 So yeah, 00:18:16.880 --> 00:18:17.280 that's awesome. 00:18:17.280 --> 00:18:17.640 It's cool. 00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:18.180 Nice. 00:18:18.180 --> 00:18:18.780 All right. 00:18:18.780 --> 00:18:23.040 So let's wrap this up with a really nice definitive statement. 00:18:23.040 --> 00:18:27.640 The last thing I want to talk to talk about is Python two's end of life. 00:18:27.640 --> 00:18:32.000 So we've spoken before how there's the Python death clock and it's, 00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:33.860 we know that in 2020, 00:18:33.860 --> 00:18:36.460 Python two will go unsupported. 00:18:36.460 --> 00:18:37.820 What exactly does that mean? 00:18:37.820 --> 00:18:39.880 How strict are they going to be about that? 00:18:39.880 --> 00:18:42.240 Is it going to be at PyCon 2020? 00:18:42.240 --> 00:18:43.600 Is it going to be the end of the year, 00:18:43.600 --> 00:18:44.320 beginning of the year? 00:18:44.320 --> 00:18:45.460 Well, 00:18:45.460 --> 00:18:45.920 my friend, 00:18:45.920 --> 00:18:46.600 Nicola Aroshi, 00:18:46.600 --> 00:18:47.220 he, 00:18:47.220 --> 00:18:49.620 who I have more news about in just a little bit, 00:18:49.620 --> 00:18:53.260 he's put this out on Twitter and got my attention. 00:18:53.900 --> 00:18:57.480 Basically there was this discussion on the Python mailing list saying, 00:18:57.480 --> 00:19:02.140 will there be a period where Python two seven is in security only status 00:19:02.140 --> 00:19:03.500 before hitting end of life. 00:19:03.500 --> 00:19:04.820 So like say 2020, 00:19:04.820 --> 00:19:07.020 will it go into like, 00:19:07.020 --> 00:19:07.400 well, 00:19:07.400 --> 00:19:08.700 we'll do security fixes for a while, 00:19:08.700 --> 00:19:10.500 but no new features and we're not changing anything. 00:19:10.500 --> 00:19:11.040 Or like, 00:19:11.040 --> 00:19:12.500 what is that going to happen earlier? 00:19:12.500 --> 00:19:14.320 Guido actually came out and said, 00:19:14.420 --> 00:19:16.440 let's not play games with semantics. 00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:17.640 The way I see it, 00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:21.380 the situation for two seven is the end of life is January 1st, 00:19:21.380 --> 00:19:23.260 2020 beginning of 2020. 00:19:23.260 --> 00:19:24.760 And there will be no updates, 00:19:24.760 --> 00:19:27.420 not even source only security patches after that date, 00:19:27.420 --> 00:19:30.140 period support from the core devs, 00:19:30.140 --> 00:19:30.880 the PSF, 00:19:30.880 --> 00:19:33.180 Python.org completely stops on that date. 00:19:33.180 --> 00:19:33.880 Yeah. 00:19:33.880 --> 00:19:34.780 There's, 00:19:34.780 --> 00:19:35.540 there's your answer. 00:19:35.540 --> 00:19:37.880 That's a pretty abundantly clear, 00:19:37.880 --> 00:19:38.240 isn't it? 00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:38.980 Yeah, 00:19:38.980 --> 00:19:40.280 but that's way out. 00:19:40.280 --> 00:19:40.800 That's like, 00:19:40.800 --> 00:19:41.360 that's like, 00:19:41.360 --> 00:19:43.240 like way in the future. 00:19:43.240 --> 00:19:44.400 That has to be at least, 00:19:44.400 --> 00:19:45.560 a year and a half away. 00:19:45.560 --> 00:19:51.860 So for those people with like millions of lines of code on Python too, 00:19:51.860 --> 00:19:55.800 they probably should start checking out things like my pie and some of the 00:19:55.800 --> 00:19:57.500 other tooling on pushing that along. 00:19:57.500 --> 00:19:57.700 Right. 00:19:57.700 --> 00:19:58.620 Yeah. 00:19:58.620 --> 00:19:59.000 Or, 00:19:59.000 --> 00:19:59.420 I mean, 00:19:59.420 --> 00:20:03.300 if you're planning on leaving your job and going to another company within the 00:20:03.300 --> 00:20:03.980 next couple of years, 00:20:03.980 --> 00:20:04.760 don't worry about it. 00:20:04.760 --> 00:20:04.940 Yeah, 00:20:04.940 --> 00:20:05.280 exactly. 00:20:05.280 --> 00:20:06.820 Or I, 00:20:06.820 --> 00:20:08.220 I know I've got a better one for you, 00:20:08.220 --> 00:20:08.380 Brian. 00:20:08.380 --> 00:20:09.080 I got a better one. 00:20:09.080 --> 00:20:13.200 Or you want to get a really sweet consulting job, 00:20:13.740 --> 00:20:15.820 migrating Python two to Python three, 00:20:15.820 --> 00:20:16.860 you know, 00:20:16.860 --> 00:20:19.920 learn all the nuances and go and, 00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:20.780 you know, 00:20:20.780 --> 00:20:23.620 when people are freaking out in November of 2019, 00:20:23.620 --> 00:20:25.740 you're going to be in sweet demand. 00:20:25.740 --> 00:20:26.540 Actually, 00:20:26.540 --> 00:20:28.020 that's not a bad idea. 00:20:28.020 --> 00:20:28.520 Right. 00:20:28.520 --> 00:20:30.860 My rate's $250 an hour to start. 00:20:30.860 --> 00:20:31.940 So let's go with that. 00:20:31.940 --> 00:20:32.880 Yeah. 00:20:33.440 --> 00:20:34.780 I can help you with this problem. 00:20:34.780 --> 00:20:35.920 It's going to take a while though. 00:20:35.920 --> 00:20:36.840 Hmm. 00:20:36.840 --> 00:20:37.560 I got, 00:20:37.560 --> 00:20:40.940 I got about a year to beef up on my conversion, 00:20:40.940 --> 00:20:42.320 do some conversion study on this. 00:20:42.320 --> 00:20:42.520 Right. 00:20:42.520 --> 00:20:42.960 All right. 00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:43.320 Yeah. 00:20:43.320 --> 00:20:44.000 Awesome. 00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:44.220 Do you, 00:20:44.220 --> 00:20:44.740 you got any, 00:20:44.740 --> 00:20:45.160 uh, 00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:47.100 news or extra things you want to throw out there? 00:20:47.100 --> 00:20:48.860 You did some recent testing code episodes, 00:20:48.860 --> 00:20:49.120 right? 00:20:49.120 --> 00:20:49.900 Yeah. 00:20:49.900 --> 00:20:50.280 So I, 00:20:50.280 --> 00:20:53.800 I guess I just wanted to shout out that I'm back into recording more often. 00:20:53.800 --> 00:20:54.300 Yeah. 00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:56.080 Yeah. 00:20:56.080 --> 00:20:57.060 Um, 00:20:57.060 --> 00:20:57.960 and I thought I'd, 00:20:57.960 --> 00:20:58.360 uh, 00:20:58.360 --> 00:20:58.940 um, 00:20:58.940 --> 00:21:01.040 I start with a little test project. 00:21:01.040 --> 00:21:03.780 So I've got a project called cards that, 00:21:03.780 --> 00:21:04.160 um, 00:21:04.160 --> 00:21:05.180 it's kind of a to do app, 00:21:05.180 --> 00:21:06.180 but I want to, 00:21:06.180 --> 00:21:08.420 I'm focusing around using it as an, 00:21:08.420 --> 00:21:13.240 just as an example bed to talk about things that I get questions about all the time. 00:21:13.240 --> 00:21:13.760 So, 00:21:13.760 --> 00:21:14.320 okay, 00:21:14.320 --> 00:21:16.440 your book is great for how to write the, 00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:17.920 the tests actually, 00:21:17.920 --> 00:21:19.920 but what tests do I write? 00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:21.380 How do I pick which tests to write? 00:21:21.380 --> 00:21:21.860 How do I, 00:21:21.860 --> 00:21:23.380 how do I pick test cases? 00:21:23.380 --> 00:21:24.280 Basically this, 00:21:24.280 --> 00:21:24.720 this, 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:25.020 um, 00:21:25.500 --> 00:21:26.860 intro to quality assurance, 00:21:26.860 --> 00:21:27.320 uh, 00:21:27.320 --> 00:21:30.220 but for busy people that don't have a QA team, 00:21:30.220 --> 00:21:31.820 how do I do that? 00:21:31.820 --> 00:21:32.720 So that's where, 00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:33.480 where we're exploring. 00:21:33.480 --> 00:21:33.740 I'm, 00:21:33.740 --> 00:21:37.900 I'm two episodes into it and I'm just going to run with it until it runs out of steam. 00:21:37.900 --> 00:21:39.120 So check those out. 00:21:39.120 --> 00:21:40.120 Those are really awesome. 00:21:40.120 --> 00:21:41.020 I think that's great, 00:21:41.020 --> 00:21:41.420 uh, 00:21:41.420 --> 00:21:41.800 advice. 00:21:41.800 --> 00:21:43.400 And when people get that wrong, 00:21:43.400 --> 00:21:45.120 testing seems super horrible, 00:21:45.120 --> 00:21:45.580 right? 00:21:45.580 --> 00:21:45.900 You're like, 00:21:45.900 --> 00:21:47.840 what do you mean I got to test every single thing? 00:21:47.840 --> 00:21:48.060 Like, 00:21:48.060 --> 00:21:50.600 like if you're focused on testing the wrong thing, 00:21:50.600 --> 00:21:51.780 you can just feel super, 00:21:51.780 --> 00:21:53.000 like it's just super busy work. 00:21:53.000 --> 00:21:53.980 Yeah. 00:21:53.980 --> 00:21:54.680 But it's, 00:21:54.680 --> 00:21:56.440 testing should be something to help you, 00:21:56.440 --> 00:21:56.880 uh, 00:21:56.880 --> 00:21:57.920 develop faster, 00:21:57.920 --> 00:21:58.840 not slow you down. 00:21:58.840 --> 00:22:00.400 And that's where I'm focusing my energy. 00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:01.300 How about you? 00:22:01.300 --> 00:22:02.040 Anything else? 00:22:02.040 --> 00:22:02.620 Well, 00:22:02.620 --> 00:22:05.560 I just got back from PyCon Slovakia. 00:22:05.560 --> 00:22:06.180 That was pretty awesome. 00:22:06.180 --> 00:22:08.320 So I wanted to send a shout out to everyone there who I met. 00:22:08.320 --> 00:22:08.840 And that was, 00:22:08.840 --> 00:22:09.500 that was fun. 00:22:09.500 --> 00:22:12.620 So if you're in central Europe ish, 00:22:12.620 --> 00:22:13.280 uh, 00:22:13.280 --> 00:22:13.860 next year, 00:22:13.860 --> 00:22:14.720 be sure to check that out. 00:22:14.720 --> 00:22:15.820 That was a good event. 00:22:15.820 --> 00:22:16.960 And also I have a new course. 00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:17.740 You do. 00:22:17.740 --> 00:22:18.800 And I'm excited about it. 00:22:18.800 --> 00:22:19.260 Yeah. 00:22:19.260 --> 00:22:20.080 it's on the most, 00:22:20.080 --> 00:22:20.540 uh, 00:22:20.540 --> 00:22:22.060 most wanted database technology. 00:22:22.060 --> 00:22:23.080 So this is our, 00:22:23.080 --> 00:22:26.240 the first course based on Flask that I have. 00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:26.780 So this is, 00:22:26.780 --> 00:22:27.040 uh, 00:22:27.040 --> 00:22:28.700 on a thing called Eve, 00:22:28.700 --> 00:22:29.200 Eve, 00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:29.660 E, 00:22:29.660 --> 00:22:30.800 the E framework, 00:22:30.800 --> 00:22:36.880 which is a way to take Flask and a MongoDB database and turn it into a really awesome, 00:22:36.880 --> 00:22:41.520 restful API with validation and business logic and all that kind of stuff. 00:22:41.520 --> 00:22:42.160 So it's, 00:22:42.160 --> 00:22:43.040 it's a super cool way. 00:22:43.040 --> 00:22:44.340 And it's like really declarative. 00:22:44.340 --> 00:22:44.880 So you say, 00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:45.860 here's my models. 00:22:45.860 --> 00:22:46.620 Here's my end points. 00:22:46.620 --> 00:22:47.880 Here's the validation for them. 00:22:47.880 --> 00:22:49.340 Make that a rest service. 00:22:49.340 --> 00:22:49.600 Go. 00:22:49.600 --> 00:22:51.200 And it's nice. 00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:52.240 So that's out now. 00:22:52.240 --> 00:22:55.120 That's actually written by Nicola Aroshi, 00:22:55.120 --> 00:22:57.560 the guy who talked about the Python two seven statement. 00:22:57.560 --> 00:22:58.480 He, 00:22:58.480 --> 00:22:59.180 he wrote that. 00:22:59.180 --> 00:23:00.000 And we just shipped it. 00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:02.420 He's also the creator and maintainer of Eve. 00:23:02.420 --> 00:23:02.940 So, 00:23:02.940 --> 00:23:03.260 uh, 00:23:03.260 --> 00:23:04.680 he's pretty qualified to talk about it. 00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:05.340 That's great. 00:23:05.340 --> 00:23:05.740 And I'm, 00:23:05.740 --> 00:23:09.640 I've already started listening to it because I'm very interested in this topic. 00:23:09.640 --> 00:23:09.960 So, 00:23:09.960 --> 00:23:10.320 yeah. 00:23:10.320 --> 00:23:10.680 Awesome. 00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:11.200 Cool. 00:23:11.200 --> 00:23:11.440 Well, 00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:12.880 links in the show notes, 00:23:12.880 --> 00:23:13.940 check that out. 00:23:13.940 --> 00:23:15.580 And I think that might be it. 00:23:15.580 --> 00:23:16.180 Um, 00:23:16.180 --> 00:23:19.760 I'm really excited that we have a concrete statement on Python two seven and it's not like, 00:23:19.760 --> 00:23:20.820 it's just vague, 00:23:20.820 --> 00:23:21.100 right? 00:23:21.100 --> 00:23:21.800 Yeah. 00:23:21.800 --> 00:23:22.860 That's good to have it. 00:23:22.860 --> 00:23:24.220 I wonder if they updated the clock. 00:23:24.220 --> 00:23:24.800 Exactly. 00:23:24.800 --> 00:23:27.040 I was just thinking that we've got to recalibrate all the clocks. 00:23:27.040 --> 00:23:28.240 Cause they were all guessing. 00:23:28.240 --> 00:23:30.320 They probably got shorter. 00:23:30.320 --> 00:23:30.640 Awesome. 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:31.360 All right. 00:23:31.360 --> 00:23:31.600 Well, 00:23:31.600 --> 00:23:32.060 thanks again, 00:23:32.060 --> 00:23:32.280 Brian. 00:23:32.280 --> 00:23:33.100 And thanks everyone for listening. 00:23:33.100 --> 00:23:37.360 Thank you for listening to Python bytes. 00:23:37.360 --> 00:23:39.920 Follow the show on Twitter via at Python bytes. 00:23:39.920 --> 00:23:41.060 That's Python bytes. 00:23:41.140 --> 00:23:45.720 as in B Y T E S and get the full show notes at Python bytes. 00:23:45.720 --> 00:23:45.940 Dot. 00:23:45.940 --> 00:23:46.220 F M. 00:23:46.220 --> 00:23:47.480 If you have a news item, 00:23:47.480 --> 00:23:48.060 you want featured, 00:23:48.060 --> 00:23:49.240 just visit Python bytes. 00:23:49.240 --> 00:23:49.380 Dot. 00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:50.600 F M and send it our way. 00:23:50.600 --> 00:23:53.320 We're always on the lookout for sharing something cool. 00:23:53.880 --> 00:23:55.460 On behalf of myself and Brian Okken. 00:23:55.460 --> 00:23:56.680 This is Michael Kennedy. 00:23:56.680 --> 00:24:00.320 Thank you for listening and sharing this podcast with your friends and colleagues.