WEBVTT 00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:59.760 Hello and welcome to Python Bytes, where we deliver Python news and headlines directly to your earbuds. This is episode 452, recorded October 9th. I'm Michael Kennedy. And I'm Brian Okken. And this episode is brought to you by DigitalOcean. I love DigitalOcean. Brian and I both use DigitalOcean. I was literally just working with them a few minutes ago. How about that? So check them out at pythonbytes.fm/digitalocean-gen-ai. The link is right at the top of the show notes and then use most importantly however you sign up use the code do4bytes all caps the number four and you'll get up to 200 of free credit you get 200 for credit if you are not already an existing customer and that is pretty awesome so free money to go do cloud things always great connect with us on the socials links here in the show notes and if you want to be part of the live episode pythonbytes.fm/live shows you if we're live streaming you can jump right to it If not, well, then it takes you to old, old episodes. 00:01:00.720 --> 00:01:04.559 And once you're over on YouTube, do us a favor, subscribe there and press the bell to get notified. 00:01:04.780 --> 00:01:09.080 That's the way when we do go live at the wrong time because things kept happening. 00:01:09.460 --> 00:01:10.360 I have a bit of a story for that. 00:01:10.680 --> 00:01:12.500 You'll get notified that we're going live. 00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:13.120 You can check it out. 00:01:13.440 --> 00:01:15.300 Usually that's Mondays at 10 a.m. Pacific time. 00:01:15.720 --> 00:01:16.640 And sign up to our newsletter. 00:01:16.860 --> 00:01:19.400 Brian puts that together every week and sends it out. 00:01:19.520 --> 00:01:22.340 And it's got more than just a rehashing of the show notes. 00:01:22.500 --> 00:01:23.500 It's got a bunch of extra info. 00:01:23.780 --> 00:01:24.820 So that's, that's always fun. 00:01:25.060 --> 00:01:29.520 Brian, one of the reasons, there are many reasons that we are on an alternate schedule this week. 00:01:29.760 --> 00:01:33.820 I had a very, very dark time fall upon House Kennedy. 00:01:34.380 --> 00:01:36.460 There were people, I live where there are tons of tall trees. 00:01:36.880 --> 00:01:41.220 In Oregon, there are tall trees, but I live especially where there are many tall trees, like right along the street. 00:01:41.860 --> 00:01:44.580 And so that we don't get the power taken out by these trees. 00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:48.140 In the winter, the power company goes along and trims back the trees. 00:01:48.540 --> 00:01:54.340 Well, the geniuses at the top of that thing cut through the fiber optic cable that provided power to my house. 00:01:54.440 --> 00:01:58.440 and I have one bar of LTE level of cell coverage at my house. 00:01:58.920 --> 00:02:05.500 So when that happened Sunday night or Sunday afternoon, and then we're supposed to record Monday morning, it was like, mm-mm. 00:02:05.600 --> 00:02:06.080 That ain't happening. 00:02:06.540 --> 00:02:07.240 It ain't happening. 00:02:07.480 --> 00:02:08.140 So sorry, folks. 00:02:08.500 --> 00:02:11.940 That's a part of the reason why we're a little bit off schedule. 00:02:12.180 --> 00:02:14.300 But light has shone upon us again. 00:02:14.480 --> 00:02:15.640 The fiber is flowing. 00:02:17.260 --> 00:02:23.080 And then, of course, we were going to do noon today, and then I had a contractor that was supposed to be here at 3, 00:02:23.340 --> 00:02:34.400 showed up at quarter to noon so we had to push back there it is there it is well what do you got to push down to everyone listen well i'm excited because one of the things we get to talk 00:02:34.580 --> 00:03:14.440 about that we wouldn't have been able to talk about if we were recording on monday was is that two days ago on tuesday python 3.14 got released and i wish i had some party poppers or something to pop up because i'm like totally stoked about this um i know so um i don't know if other people are but there's some really cool stuff in 3.14 or three the pi by release by yeah I don't know um uh 3.1 are they gonna do like for the bug fix releases instead of going like 3.4.0 this 3.14.0 right now and then it'll go dot one dot two but I think it should go dot one and then one five and 00:03:14.440 --> 00:03:21.460 then one five nine yes that'd be fun yes come on let's do it it's still and it's still incrementing Let's do it. 00:03:21.800 --> 00:03:23.060 It's still, yeah, bigger. 00:03:23.980 --> 00:03:24.180 Anyway. 00:03:24.200 --> 00:03:26.560 And look, they were guaranteed to not run out. 00:03:26.800 --> 00:03:28.820 It's an irrational number that goes on forever. 00:03:28.960 --> 00:03:29.640 It's going to be fine. 00:03:30.420 --> 00:03:33.720 Yeah, I think it would break some people to have like a really long version. 00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:37.300 But I'm cutting into our logo. 00:03:37.800 --> 00:03:40.940 OK, so we're linking. 00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:44.060 I'm going to link to what's new in the release. 00:03:44.280 --> 00:03:46.280 And there is a ton of stuff in here. 00:03:46.480 --> 00:03:47.860 So please check it out. 00:03:48.160 --> 00:03:49.160 I think there's some great stuff. 00:03:49.340 --> 00:03:53.180 I wanted to highlight a handful of things that I'm pretty excited about. 00:03:53.580 --> 00:03:57.980 Template string literals, and I have to admit, I still don't quite get it. 00:03:58.120 --> 00:04:03.320 I'm going to have to do a project that actually uses template string literals, the new template strings. 00:04:04.980 --> 00:04:07.160 The prefix T instead of F, so t-strings. 00:04:07.550 --> 00:04:08.560 Are we calling them t-strings? 00:04:08.980 --> 00:04:09.320 I don't know. 00:04:09.500 --> 00:04:10.540 Yes, we are calling them t-strings. 00:04:10.760 --> 00:04:16.180 I had Paul Everett and some other folks, who I'm sorry, I'm forgetting, on Talk Python last year to talk about it when it was proposed. 00:04:16.380 --> 00:04:16.859 Yeah, t-strings. 00:04:17.180 --> 00:04:17.440 Okay. 00:04:17.780 --> 00:04:19.959 I should, I guess, just go back and listen to that episode. 00:04:21.060 --> 00:04:22.360 Anyway, excited to try this. 00:04:22.860 --> 00:04:28.520 And I think I am excited to see what people build on top of this as well. 00:04:29.180 --> 00:04:32.520 Possibly we can have some cool stuff built on top of two strings. 00:04:33.980 --> 00:04:34.340 What else? 00:04:35.580 --> 00:04:36.960 This is pretty cool, actually. 00:04:37.840 --> 00:04:43.940 Seems kind of minor, but PEP758 is allow, accept, and accept star expressions without brackets. 00:04:44.540 --> 00:04:46.060 So what's the deal here? 00:04:46.260 --> 00:04:53.420 Well, if you had multiple exceptions that you were catching, like in the example, they have timeout error and connection refused error. 00:04:53.840 --> 00:04:57.200 Those had to be in brackets, but now they can just be just like there. 00:04:57.400 --> 00:04:58.820 They're just, you don't have to have brackets. 00:04:59.120 --> 00:05:00.920 It's a minor thing, but it saves typing. 00:05:01.090 --> 00:05:01.560 I love it. 00:05:01.750 --> 00:05:01.880 Okay. 00:05:03.340 --> 00:05:05.060 Improved error messages, always better. 00:05:05.540 --> 00:05:11.520 Like if you typed while with two L's or something, more highlighting of where you have a syntax error. 00:05:11.800 --> 00:05:12.020 Perfect. 00:05:12.540 --> 00:05:14.660 More better tracebacks are always helpful. 00:05:15.020 --> 00:05:15.540 What else? 00:05:16.880 --> 00:05:21.760 So one of the things that came in is some, oh, default interactive shell. 00:05:22.580 --> 00:05:27.000 So the default, there's a couple of improvements to the shell. 00:05:27.110 --> 00:05:33.560 So when you just, the rebel, when you type like Python or Python-I or whatever, the interactive thing, it's in color now. 00:05:34.540 --> 00:05:39.340 And one of the things is it's in color and also it does syntax highlighting. 00:05:39.700 --> 00:05:40.320 So that's pretty cool. 00:05:40.430 --> 00:05:41.340 I thought I had a screenshot. 00:05:41.420 --> 00:05:45.880 Yeah, so fun to have colors in the REPL. 00:05:45.930 --> 00:05:50.960 I know there were other non-standard REPLs that did this, so I'm glad that the standard was. 00:05:51.660 --> 00:05:52.100 Yeah, that's great. 00:05:52.640 --> 00:05:53.280 What else we got? 00:05:54.480 --> 00:05:55.560 I thought I had a couple other things. 00:05:56.280 --> 00:05:57.560 Default and directive shell. 00:05:57.980 --> 00:06:03.140 In improved modules, I'm actually pretty excited about the arg parse stuff. 00:06:04.380 --> 00:06:11.420 The arg parse, if you're writing a command line interface tool, like a CLI tool that takes arguments. 00:06:11.570 --> 00:06:19.460 You can use click or typer, but the built-in one is arg parse, which I've been using more and more for small projects. 00:06:20.040 --> 00:06:20.420 So have I. 00:06:20.600 --> 00:06:24.160 If it doesn't have a dependency, but you wanted to take arguments, just use arg parse. 00:06:24.540 --> 00:06:24.800 Yeah. 00:06:25.820 --> 00:06:30.520 So then a couple of things, if name equals main or not. 00:06:30.820 --> 00:06:39.260 So if you say Python-M and then your module, your project, that didn't quite work right before or it was like, I don't know. 00:06:39.400 --> 00:06:43.360 I didn't try it with arg parse, but apparently that's better now. 00:06:43.630 --> 00:06:44.320 So that's cool. 00:06:44.640 --> 00:06:49.560 The other thing that I'm pretty excited about is this suggest on error. 00:06:49.960 --> 00:07:06.300 So this is a thing where you basically, if you type in a, it's not on by default, but if you turn it on and you pass an argument to your command line interface thing and you mistype it, it can say that isn't here, but did you mean? 00:07:06.900 --> 00:07:09.000 And I love that sort of a feature. 00:07:09.180 --> 00:07:09.820 So that's pretty cool. 00:07:10.480 --> 00:07:12.060 And then colored help text. 00:07:12.460 --> 00:07:12.940 That's pretty neat. 00:07:13.120 --> 00:07:13.900 And what do I have? 00:07:14.120 --> 00:07:16.420 Oh, last thing I thought was just fun. 00:07:17.380 --> 00:07:18.660 This is a whole bunch of stuff. 00:07:18.880 --> 00:07:19.160 Check it out. 00:07:19.400 --> 00:07:22.340 But the date, the calendar. 00:07:23.000 --> 00:07:23.600 Do you ever use this? 00:07:23.760 --> 00:07:25.740 I occasionally use the calendar module. 00:07:25.900 --> 00:07:27.260 I've never used the calendar. 00:07:27.380 --> 00:07:29.280 I know what it does, but I've never used it. 00:07:29.500 --> 00:07:34.760 Okay, so if you do Python-M calendar, and then it has some flags and stuff you can use too. 00:07:35.100 --> 00:07:36.220 It just prints out of the calendar. 00:07:36.600 --> 00:07:41.280 But now with this release, it highlights the current date. 00:07:42.180 --> 00:07:46.380 So you can say like calendar 2025 10 for October of 2025. 00:07:46.960 --> 00:07:48.640 And it highlights that it's the ninth today. 00:07:48.960 --> 00:07:54.640 And if you do the, if you just do the whole year, it'll show you the whole year and it does the ninth. 00:07:54.860 --> 00:08:01.960 So this is pretty handy if you just have a ripple around to, if you're like, when is the, if somebody says, hey, can you meet on the 15th? 00:08:02.220 --> 00:08:03.160 When is the 15th? 00:08:03.180 --> 00:08:03.780 Is it Tuesday? 00:08:04.000 --> 00:08:04.100 Whatever. 00:08:04.500 --> 00:08:05.660 You can pull this up. 00:08:06.120 --> 00:08:06.720 Yeah, that's pretty cool. 00:08:07.420 --> 00:08:08.100 Lots of great stuff. 00:08:08.320 --> 00:08:10.400 Check out the what's new and upgrade. 00:08:11.500 --> 00:08:16.260 As an aside, I wasn't going to get ready for today, but I didn't get a chance because of all the contractor stuff. 00:08:17.000 --> 00:08:17.780 I'm going to get up. 00:08:18.760 --> 00:08:28.500 Probably by the time you listen to this, I'll have an article up on Python test for all the changes you need to make sure you make to test your project for 3.14. 00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:33.620 It's the normal stuff, but I figured I'd just write it down and I'll do a post about that too. 00:08:33.960 --> 00:08:35.280 Awesome. Yeah, looking forward to it. 00:08:35.500 --> 00:08:37.659 I have a few follow-ups, a few rough edges. 00:08:38.200 --> 00:08:38.380 Okay. 00:08:38.380 --> 00:08:41.520 I have one smooth, nice edge, and then a couple rough edges. 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:53.420 So the smooth edge is that Charlie Marsh announced that uv and rough both shipped Python 3.14 support the day 3.14 came out, which is pretty cool. 00:08:53.670 --> 00:09:01.920 So if you uv, V, E, and V, and you don't have anything installed, or if you specify 3.14, you'll get the 3.14.0 release, which is awesome. 00:09:02.300 --> 00:09:05.460 But remember that you have to actually update the uv binary. 00:09:05.610 --> 00:09:07.380 It doesn't look at a web service or something. 00:09:07.650 --> 00:09:11.700 So if you've got an old uv that's not 0.9, it doesn't know about the new one. 00:09:12.080 --> 00:09:13.880 So uv self-update. 00:09:14.680 --> 00:09:14.880 Yes. 00:09:14.880 --> 00:09:15.980 If you have it globally installed. 00:09:16.620 --> 00:09:17.740 Which is how I do it. 00:09:18.030 --> 00:09:18.160 Indeed. 00:09:18.740 --> 00:09:19.940 Okay, so that's the smooth edge. 00:09:20.050 --> 00:09:27.060 The rough edge is for Python bytes, I use uv loop for the asyncio operations on Python bytes.fm. 00:09:27.380 --> 00:09:28.680 Well, I thought, ah, what the heck? 00:09:28.780 --> 00:09:32.320 Let me just swap out the virtual environment locally and see what happens today. 00:09:32.480 --> 00:09:33.400 You know, just try it out. 00:09:33.520 --> 00:09:33.720 Why not? 00:09:33.720 --> 00:09:35.000 I'll be able to say we're using 3.14. 00:09:35.220 --> 00:09:35.760 I'll just roll it out. 00:09:35.860 --> 00:09:36.640 And then guess what? 00:09:37.040 --> 00:09:37.600 It didn't like it. 00:09:38.720 --> 00:09:44.740 It crashed and it literally wouldn't load the website because apparently uv does not support 3.14. 00:09:45.140 --> 00:09:45.980 UV loop rather. 00:09:46.600 --> 00:09:48.700 Sorry, not uv, uv loop. 00:09:49.120 --> 00:09:49.740 There are different things. 00:09:50.140 --> 00:09:54.120 So uv loop is a way to speed up the asyncio event loop for async and await. 00:09:54.480 --> 00:09:56.740 And it's been fine for a long time. 00:09:57.040 --> 00:09:59.560 It was updated like three weeks ago, but it's not updated for this. 00:09:59.700 --> 00:10:02.420 So I just took it out and said, you know what, we're just going to fall back. 00:10:02.820 --> 00:10:05.700 Python's got a lot faster since I added that way, way back when. 00:10:05.970 --> 00:10:08.940 And so just run on the standard old asyncio event loop. 00:10:09.140 --> 00:10:10.400 Well, it's a good thing you checked. 00:10:10.660 --> 00:10:18.100 But everybody that's got a project out there that other people are depending on, most of the Python versions that we roll to, there's no problems. 00:10:18.520 --> 00:10:21.500 But occasionally, something you're doing might be an issue. 00:10:21.690 --> 00:10:24.020 So please test and roll out new versions. 00:10:24.340 --> 00:10:25.580 I have another sharp edge for you. 00:10:25.580 --> 00:10:28.200 I have no idea if this is true in VS Code, though it may be. 00:10:28.330 --> 00:10:29.780 But honestly, I haven't tried it. 00:10:29.780 --> 00:10:30.080 I don't know. 00:10:30.340 --> 00:10:34.880 But in cursor, I can tell you that you cannot debug something in Python 3.14. 00:10:35.220 --> 00:10:42.180 You hit run, it says, cannot find underscore underscore handle crash or something along those lines, at least the projects that I tried. 00:10:42.560 --> 00:10:44.300 So a few people got some updating to do. 00:10:46.040 --> 00:10:47.080 Brian, here's the thing, though. 00:10:47.340 --> 00:10:49.160 Wasn't this stuff available for like six months? 00:10:49.580 --> 00:10:50.560 Yeah, it's been available. 00:10:50.800 --> 00:10:52.760 I mean, I'll give the uv loop guys a pass, right? 00:10:52.900 --> 00:10:55.020 Like that's not a main thing they're working on and like whatever. 00:10:55.540 --> 00:10:56.300 Maybe it needs testing. 00:10:57.180 --> 00:11:01.700 But I mean, a product such like Cursor that's got so, they update that thing like daily. 00:11:02.400 --> 00:11:04.200 There should probably have been somebody that tested that. 00:11:04.420 --> 00:11:14.040 Also, before we move on, one of the things that I think projects should do, it's questionable whether you should bump your version, right? 00:11:14.300 --> 00:11:22.840 So if you've got a project that other people are depending on and it just runs fine, you run it locally, you test it on 3.14 and it works fine. 00:11:23.220 --> 00:11:26.620 Maybe you even turn on testing in CI at 3.14. 00:11:27.100 --> 00:11:30.180 but you didn't have to make any changes should you do another version. 00:11:30.400 --> 00:11:38.660 And I think at least even a minor version bump so that you can add the Trove classifier to say this one runs on the new version. 00:11:38.940 --> 00:11:39.960 I think it's worth it. 00:11:40.180 --> 00:11:48.740 It's also, I look, other people look, and if a project hasn't had a release in a few years or a couple of years, I don't know that anybody's looking at it. 00:11:48.900 --> 00:11:49.800 - Yeah, it might be dead. 00:11:50.640 --> 00:11:58.260 - So I think once a year when we roll out new versions, that might be a time to bump your version just to let people know it's still alive and it's fine. 00:11:58.780 --> 00:12:00.240 - Yeah, I agree with that. 00:12:00.320 --> 00:12:00.720 That sounds cool. 00:12:01.040 --> 00:12:05.580 All right, let's go back and talk about, checking your libraries for versions that work. 00:12:06.179 --> 00:12:15.060 So I bring you, zoom out a little so it looks a little better, the Python compatibility checker for free threaded Python. 00:12:15.520 --> 00:12:15.760 - Okay. 00:12:16.199 --> 00:12:20.720 - Okay, so this is a heat map of, over over it, where do I get it like that? 00:12:21.020 --> 00:12:22.060 It doesn't do anything, you can click it. 00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:29.480 But it's a heat map of the most popular libraries, If I scroll down here somewhere, you can see it's got the most installed ones. 00:12:29.680 --> 00:12:34.320 So Boto3, Care Set Normalizer, URL3, requests, BotoCore, et cetera. 00:12:34.690 --> 00:12:42.320 And most importantly, it tells you, is that thing thread safe in the sense that can I use it with Python T instead of Python, right? 00:12:42.440 --> 00:12:44.020 The free threaded version of Python. 00:12:45.220 --> 00:12:45.780 I don't know. 00:12:45.940 --> 00:12:49.400 It's more blue than red, but there's still a lot of red out there. 00:12:49.680 --> 00:12:49.920 Yeah. 00:12:50.280 --> 00:12:50.680 There's failed. 00:12:50.820 --> 00:12:51.300 There's no data. 00:12:52.660 --> 00:13:06.660 So I put this out there as a way for if you're involved in the top 1000 packages, maybe give this a look, see what they're testing, give Python 313, 314T a test, like work into your test mix. 00:13:07.050 --> 00:13:10.280 And if you don't want to support it, fine, be like, just be explicit about it. 00:13:10.380 --> 00:13:15.260 But if there's just a super minor little threading issue or some condition or 00:13:15.480 --> 00:13:17.340 whatever, you know, it'd be cool if it was supported. 00:13:17.480 --> 00:13:21.320 Like that's, that's the primary reason that the two to three thing was so rough. 00:13:21.820 --> 00:13:25.980 It was like, not that we all couldn't decide to start writing Python 3 style code. 00:13:26.060 --> 00:13:30.860 It was like, well, the library I need to do this depends on a library that doesn't work in 3. 00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:34.780 And we've got a similar story for free threading here, although I suspect it's less. 00:13:35.120 --> 00:13:37.820 Anyway, I present to you ft-checker.com. 00:13:38.180 --> 00:13:41.640 And you can see if the things that you care about support free threaded Python. 00:13:41.900 --> 00:13:44.260 Tina, is there, how many things are they checking? 00:13:44.700 --> 00:13:46.140 Oh, 500 things, top 500. 00:13:46.720 --> 00:13:48.580 Well, I think I can scroll in and let me look. 00:13:49.180 --> 00:13:51.100 I think it's the top 1,000 or almost. 00:13:51.680 --> 00:13:54.000 Almost like top 987. 00:13:54.280 --> 00:13:56.240 Maybe they couldn't get information about some of them. 00:13:57.100 --> 00:13:57.540 Top thousand. 00:13:57.780 --> 00:13:58.320 What else is cool? 00:13:58.660 --> 00:13:59.140 Our sponsor. 00:13:59.740 --> 00:14:00.100 Yes. 00:14:00.340 --> 00:14:02.200 Thank you so much to DigitalOcean. 00:14:02.540 --> 00:14:05.340 This episode of Python Bytes is brought to you by DigitalOcean. 00:14:05.640 --> 00:14:11.640 DigitalOcean is a comprehensive cloud infrastructure that's simple to spin up, even for the most complex workloads. 00:14:11.940 --> 00:14:14.720 And it's a way better value than most cloud providers. 00:14:15.100 --> 00:14:18.480 At DigitalOcean, companies can save up to 30% off their cloud bill. 00:14:18.860 --> 00:14:25.660 DigitalOcean boasts 99.99% uptime, SLAs, and industry-leading pricing on bandwidth. 00:14:26.060 --> 00:14:29.860 It's built to be the cloud backbone of businesses small and large. 00:14:30.050 --> 00:14:40.980 And with GPU-powered virtual machines plus storage, databases, and network capabilities all in one platform, AI developers can confidently create apps using what their users love. 00:14:41.280 --> 00:15:02.460 Devs have access to the complete set of infrastructure tools they need for both training and inference so they can build anything they dream up. 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Thank you to DigitalOcean for supporting Python Bytes and for having an awesome service. 00:15:38.420 --> 00:15:38.780 Absolutely. 00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:40.220 Yeah, they do really good stuff. 00:15:40.520 --> 00:15:44.180 I just recently moved a bunch of stuff to, what do they call it? 00:15:44.780 --> 00:15:47.460 DigitalOcean Spaces to save some, store some things. 00:15:47.720 --> 00:15:50.800 I was working at DigitalOcean Spaces 30 minutes before we started. 00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:51.860 Like I said, very cool. 00:15:52.180 --> 00:15:52.420 Good stuff. 00:15:52.640 --> 00:15:54.200 So was I using AI? 00:15:54.420 --> 00:15:55.080 Was I not, Brian? 00:15:55.180 --> 00:15:55.720 That's the question. 00:15:56.120 --> 00:15:58.380 There's a big new model out there. 00:15:58.780 --> 00:16:02.260 So I want to give a shout out to Claude Sonnet 4.5. 00:16:02.740 --> 00:16:04.400 I think this is worth checking out. 00:16:04.560 --> 00:16:34.140 if you're using something that lets you choose a model there are many of them now as we'll see using sonnet 4.5 is quite good so have you been playing with this yet it only came out like a couple days ago or maybe a week ago it came out basically the day we recorded last now i have not had a chance to play with it so faster than the older clods a little bit better i say it's even better than the opus one which was like setting money on fire if you tried to use that thing it It was like 100 times more expensive or something. 00:16:34.150 --> 00:16:35.640 It was out of control. 00:16:36.120 --> 00:16:36.920 So let's see. 00:16:37.020 --> 00:16:40.920 I took a few notes of some of the things that I thought were kind of noteworthy of it. 00:16:41.060 --> 00:16:44.820 So apparently it ranks as the top programming model, which is pretty cool. 00:16:45.320 --> 00:16:47.260 And we live in such weird times. 00:16:47.520 --> 00:16:55.960 Our programming tool has reduced concerning behaviors like sycophancy, deception, power seeking, and a tendency to encourage delusional thinking. 00:16:56.460 --> 00:16:58.980 Hey, I guess it's good if your programming tool doesn't do that. 00:17:00.640 --> 00:17:01.120 Isn't that right? 00:17:01.340 --> 00:17:03.700 I mean, would you want your programming tool to be sycophant? 00:17:04.060 --> 00:17:04.280 No. 00:17:04.699 --> 00:17:05.579 Come on, not really. 00:17:05.740 --> 00:17:07.720 A little sycophant is good, but not too much. 00:17:07.900 --> 00:17:10.180 Michael, if you don't want it to be, then that's a good thing. 00:17:10.680 --> 00:17:11.380 That's right. 00:17:12.880 --> 00:17:13.939 You're absolutely right. 00:17:16.080 --> 00:17:17.300 I didn't think of that. 00:17:17.410 --> 00:17:17.740 Good job. 00:17:18.920 --> 00:17:19.860 Gosh, I was confused. 00:17:20.079 --> 00:17:20.800 I've been a bad bot. 00:17:22.060 --> 00:17:28.760 They've also, as part of this, released the Cloud Agent SDK, which is what they use to build Claude Code. 00:17:29.280 --> 00:17:30.500 So that's pretty cool. 00:17:31.040 --> 00:17:34.840 If you want to bring that into your own platform and do it. 00:17:35.370 --> 00:17:45.160 And speaking of which, JetBrains, their AI platform now allows you to use Sonic 4.5 as well, built right into PyCharm. 00:17:45.460 --> 00:17:46.500 That's pretty sweet. 00:17:46.920 --> 00:17:53.980 And of course, Klein.bot supports it because that one lets you just put in your key and you get your thing. 00:17:53.990 --> 00:17:57.340 That plugs into both PyCharm and VS Code and Cursor and all the things. 00:17:57.700 --> 00:17:58.600 On cursor, you can pick it. 00:17:58.780 --> 00:18:01.000 And cloud code, obviously, you can pick it because it's from them. 00:18:01.160 --> 00:18:01.980 Here you can even see at the top. 00:18:02.360 --> 00:18:04.920 New cloud sign at 4.5 is live and client. 00:18:05.200 --> 00:18:07.320 So anyway, I encourage people to check it out. 00:18:07.320 --> 00:18:09.800 I've been doing some significant work with it. 00:18:09.860 --> 00:18:12.940 I actually did two PRs to Python by set FM. 00:18:13.460 --> 00:18:15.340 One is like 4,300 lines. 00:18:15.440 --> 00:18:17.920 One is 3,000 lines just in the last day. 00:18:18.320 --> 00:18:19.620 And they came out incredibly. 00:18:19.960 --> 00:18:23.660 I haven't had time to show you, Brian, but after this, I can show you and see what you think. 00:18:23.780 --> 00:18:24.420 It's pretty neat. 00:18:24.820 --> 00:18:27.660 Did the first one change all the quotes to double quotes 00:18:27.680 --> 00:18:29.460 I'm going to change all the double quotes to single quotes. 00:18:30.720 --> 00:18:31.520 That's a good question. 00:18:31.600 --> 00:18:37.860 No, I actually, I have a bunch of rules that tell it it has to run ruff format and rough check before and after it does everything. 00:18:38.320 --> 00:18:42.100 So it's like, it's always sort of staying in sync with the way that I want. 00:18:42.100 --> 00:18:43.600 It won't cycle back and forth like that. 00:18:43.900 --> 00:18:44.040 Yeah. 00:18:44.320 --> 00:18:45.900 I'm curious about what was it? 00:18:46.040 --> 00:18:47.360 The, Hacktober. 00:18:47.800 --> 00:18:48.820 is it, 00:18:49.000 --> 00:18:49.580 Oh yeah. 00:18:49.840 --> 00:18:50.880 That's going to be different, isn't it? 00:18:51.180 --> 00:18:51.340 Yeah. 00:18:51.460 --> 00:18:52.320 With all the tools. 00:18:53.320 --> 00:19:03.360 Although to be fair, I don't know if it's going to be better or worse because I know some of those Hacktoberfests, I would get the dumbest things like, oh, if you submit a PR to an open source project, guess what? 00:19:03.620 --> 00:19:04.640 You get a star. 00:19:05.100 --> 00:19:09.760 And I would get this like, I'm correcting this bit of grammar in your readme. 00:19:09.960 --> 00:19:12.140 Like, I'm not even sure that's the correct grammar. 00:19:12.640 --> 00:19:19.640 And no, I'm not taking a PR that you put like a semicolon or instead of a colon here because you want a Hacktoberfest thing. 00:19:19.660 --> 00:19:20.460 Get away from me, people. 00:19:20.840 --> 00:19:21.020 Yeah. 00:19:21.440 --> 00:19:26.700 Well, and I kind of am jealous about some of the popularity of projects. 00:19:26.990 --> 00:19:29.700 A lot of the projects I work on are not that popular, which is fine. 00:19:30.300 --> 00:19:39.960 But also in October, I'm not that upset about it because I just ever heard from, for example, David Lord already said that he's gotten a bunch of stuff. 00:19:41.020 --> 00:19:41.160 Yeah. 00:19:41.740 --> 00:19:41.960 Anyway. 00:19:42.560 --> 00:19:51.840 Before we move on from this, a follow-up on the 3.14 thing from Jared says, I'm really looking forward to Python 3.14's REPL letting you tab complete import statements. 00:19:52.240 --> 00:19:52.620 Oh my gosh, please. 00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:53.660 I didn't notice that. 00:19:53.900 --> 00:19:54.260 That's great. 00:19:54.330 --> 00:19:54.840 Let it happen. 00:19:55.740 --> 00:20:04.700 I'm so tired of like, I hit up arrow and it like goes line by line through a loop or there's no autocomplete or I'll type part of a thing and come back and it's like, no, you didn't type anything. 00:20:04.730 --> 00:20:06.020 We're just going to cycle through what you did. 00:20:06.110 --> 00:20:06.480 Like, no. 00:20:07.000 --> 00:20:08.720 So all those improvements are very welcome. 00:20:09.080 --> 00:20:09.280 Yeah. 00:20:09.590 --> 00:20:09.700 Indeed. 00:20:10.050 --> 00:20:10.180 Cool. 00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:18.320 Well, as grateful as I am for Python 3.14, I'm looking forward to 3.15. 00:20:19.100 --> 00:20:19.900 Ryan, don't be lazy. 00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:21.500 Work with the stuff that you got. 00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:21.880 Come on. 00:20:22.350 --> 00:20:22.480 Okay. 00:20:23.000 --> 00:20:29.860 Well, in Python 3.15, one of the things that's coming is explicit lazy imports. 00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:33.380 And boy, this is an inside baseball kind of thing. 00:20:33.640 --> 00:20:37.180 But that's what this podcast is all about, isn't it? 00:20:38.440 --> 00:20:39.460 I'm here for it. 00:20:39.500 --> 00:20:40.700 I am so here for this idea. 00:20:40.980 --> 00:20:41.540 I am too. 00:20:42.200 --> 00:20:44.420 PEP 8.10, explicit lazy imports. 00:20:44.920 --> 00:20:48.700 So the idea is actually, it's just common. 00:20:48.790 --> 00:20:50.700 We put imports at the top of the file, right? 00:20:51.040 --> 00:20:56.460 But if you do that, then everything that imports it imports all your imports also. 00:20:57.440 --> 00:20:59.620 And you don't actually have to do that. 00:20:59.670 --> 00:21:02.260 You can put, anyway, we'll get back that. 00:21:02.380 --> 00:21:07.840 You can put them in a function or something and they'll get imported for the entire module the first time they're used. 00:21:09.420 --> 00:21:11.400 That's the way we do lazy imports now. 00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:15.840 In the future, it'll do that automatically if you just throw a lazy in front of it. 00:21:15.910 --> 00:21:17.700 So it'll work with lazy import. 00:21:17.890 --> 00:21:22.480 You can say lazy import JSON, and JSON won't get imported until the first time. 00:21:22.790 --> 00:21:28.240 Or you can do lazy import JSON from, or lazy from JSON import dumps or something. 00:21:28.420 --> 00:21:29.960 You can do the from thing as well. 00:21:30.150 --> 00:21:34.380 So either way, it won't load it until it's needed. 00:21:34.670 --> 00:21:39.520 And this is a minor little syntax thing that's going to save a lot. 00:21:39.690 --> 00:21:40.440 I love this. 00:21:40.940 --> 00:21:42.440 So do you have any thoughts on this? 00:21:43.100 --> 00:21:44.160 I am here for it. 00:21:44.460 --> 00:21:51.820 So it drives me crazy that just because I want to allow my code to use a library, it has to process all of that all the time. 00:21:51.880 --> 00:22:00.160 And if there's some kind of weird edge case, like it depends upon some configuration, but the configuration environment variable is not set, it'll crash during import. 00:22:00.300 --> 00:22:01.480 Like there's all these weird cases. 00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:06.000 And I talked a little while ago about, I think I said, Michael learns a lesson, right? 00:22:06.020 --> 00:22:13.760 I had something that was a little utility built inside of Talk Python's code base or the course's code base or whatever. 00:22:13.910 --> 00:22:16.180 And I'm like, oh, I'll just reuse these few little utility things. 00:22:16.600 --> 00:22:22.680 And because of that, just the import statements to load up all of that code made it take several seconds to start. 00:22:22.770 --> 00:22:26.400 I put it in its own file and copied a few utilities over and it took like 100 mil. 00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:27.320 It was like 10 times faster. 00:22:27.740 --> 00:22:29.220 And it's exactly because of this. 00:22:29.230 --> 00:22:31.540 It didn't use any of that stuff or hardly any of that stuff. 00:22:31.780 --> 00:22:35.260 It just pulled it in because it's got to get the library 00:22:35.520 --> 00:22:36.460 from a sub package. 00:22:36.720 --> 00:22:37.900 So off it goes, you know what I mean? 00:22:38.120 --> 00:22:42.480 Yeah, where I get hit a lot is, And actually, we have a side. 00:22:42.740 --> 00:22:45.000 Maybe I jumped the gun on this from Hugo. 00:22:45.460 --> 00:22:46.040 Lazy Imports. 00:22:46.190 --> 00:22:46.460 I forgot. 00:22:46.940 --> 00:22:47.640 This is a draft. 00:22:48.480 --> 00:22:49.520 It's not approved yet. 00:22:49.620 --> 00:22:49.980 It's a draft. 00:22:50.160 --> 00:22:52.680 So maybe it comes in at 315. 00:22:53.020 --> 00:22:56.380 Right-click and say Inspect Element, and then you can just edit the status. 00:22:56.580 --> 00:22:57.020 It'll be fine. 00:22:58.820 --> 00:22:59.700 It's a wiki, right? 00:22:59.830 --> 00:23:00.700 I can just change it? 00:23:02.060 --> 00:23:02.480 That's for you. 00:23:02.850 --> 00:23:05.440 So PEP 810 is still in draft and under discussion. 00:23:05.570 --> 00:23:07.520 It's not submitted to the steering council yet. 00:23:07.780 --> 00:23:08.480 So thanks, Hugo. 00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:10.220 But I guess here's my vote. 00:23:10.260 --> 00:23:11.080 I hope it gets in. 00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:12.140 Yeah. 00:23:12.600 --> 00:23:12.680 Yeah. 00:23:13.220 --> 00:23:15.160 And I hope this is in as well. 00:23:15.520 --> 00:23:15.820 Thanks, you guys. 00:23:17.000 --> 00:23:24.980 One of the, but another article I should probably write is how to do this with testing, because I do this with testing a lot. 00:23:25.100 --> 00:23:34.920 I'll throw, it's common to have a test module that like has to import quite a few things to test things or report things or draw a graph or all sorts of stuff you can do. 00:23:36.060 --> 00:23:41.780 But what pytest does is it imports all of your test code before it starts running. 00:23:42.180 --> 00:23:49.080 And even if you want to, so if you're going to just run one test file, like one test within your file, it'll do all the imports. 00:23:49.600 --> 00:23:53.160 So it is nice to separate your heavy imports. 00:23:53.520 --> 00:24:00.440 And there's ways to measure to figure out which ones your heavy imports are and move those into a lazy method or lazy import. 00:24:01.260 --> 00:24:03.120 But anyway, hopefully it'll come in. 00:24:03.340 --> 00:24:03.960 I hope so too. 00:24:04.120 --> 00:24:05.200 I'm here for this idea. 00:24:05.700 --> 00:24:13.240 By the way, I also see you, Dino Veland and Brittany Reynoso and some of the folks from the Cinder team at Meta. 00:24:13.640 --> 00:24:15.880